What is a gender neutral replacement for man, guys, buddy, etc?
So I've realized that in conversations I'll use traditional terms for men as general terms for all genders, both singularly and for groups. I always mean it well, but I've been thinking that it's not as inclusive to women/trans people.
For example I would say:
"What's up guys?" "How's it going man?" "Good job, my dude!” etc.
Replacing these terms with person, people, etc sounds awkward. Y'all works but sounds very southern US (nowhere near where I am located) so it sounds out of place.
So what are some better options?
Edit: thanks for all the answers peoples, I appreciate the honest ones and some of the funny ones.
The simplest approach is to just drop the usage of guys, man, etc. Folks for groups and mate for singular appeal to me when I do want to add one in between friends.
I agree. It's the plural of "you" that should be the official standard, since it disambiguates "you." It can even be broadened to include larger groups via "all y'all," as in, not just y'all in talking to, but all y'all in the house.
I feel like “guys” is fairly un-gendered but people disagree with me. Personally, I haven’t used the word “guys” to refer to anything male in what seems like forever.
I'm a cis woman in IT, I'm guy, dude, man, bro... I don't really care. You can change to make a specific person feel more confortable but most woman don't care to be dude or guy
Reconsider whether it's worth being friends with people that insist on fighting over the term "guys".
And if you are surrounded by a lot of particularly sensitive people, just call them "friend" or "friends". It works for people you both like and dislike. Glorious.
Sure, but as a professional (teacher) I’m not willing to put my career on the line by challenging a sensitive parent. A few years ago we were told not to use that word, and when it comes to things like that, I do as I’m told.
Modifying my language choices is literally the least I can do to make people feel more included, so anyone who can't fathom doing that is for sure, not worthy of being a friend.
Ive generally always agreed with the former comment, but I've heard this argument a few times and it does demonstrate the disconnect well. I've switched it up to a simple y'all.
As a former resident of San Diego I have no problem sleeping with dudes. Because everyone is dude.
People think they're clever when they ask "would you sleep with the dude?" My response is " bold of you to assume that I haven't."
Everyone is dude. You can try to twist things as much as you like but dude normalization reigns supreme.
I say "greetings earthling(s)" but I also like gumshoe!
Also definitely adding "listen up assholes" to the rotation, my coworkers appreciate your suggestions!
I’m AFAB enby, saying “you guys” and calling me “dude” is fine. Those to me aren’t gendered anymore. The people who get offended at general terms like these for groups of people need to touch grass.
But if you’re dead set on it, embrace y’all lol. Just don’t say it with a southern drawl and you’ll be fine. It’s a fantastic gender neutral term. You can also just train yourself not to add in the “you guys” to the “what’s up” phrase, and maybe just say “what’s up with you?” “What’s up with you all?” Etc.
Many trans folks are, understandably, bummed out when gendered terms that refer to their AGAB are used to refer to them.
I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to avoid causing that brief moment of dysphoria. That just feels like a thoughtful and kind thing to do.
It’s good that OP means well, but also there are so many of us who do not care and are not affected because we know the speaker is using a generalized term and isn’t (usually) being malicious with it. I call several of my cisgender girl friends “dude” and “bro” and I’ll call men “girl” as a joke sometimes (like, girl what are you doing?). Many of these terms simply have completely lost their original gendered meaning in a lot of contexts.
You can also just train yourself not to add in the “you guys” to the “what’s up” phrase, and maybe just say “what’s up with you?” “What’s up with you all?” Etc.
This is likely the best solution, but also a hard one. Thanks for the perspective though.
The simplest approach is to accept language is inherently gendered, and at a certain point it is exhausting to either take offense to everything or walk on eggshells.
I’m southern, so I use y’all almost exclusively lol
I'm more of a "be the change you wish to see" kinda person. I'll neutralize my language to encourage others to do the same, eroding the banks of the river of language in the direction I wish it to go.
If someone is insulted that you use the term "guys" for a group, they're not worth being friends with. That's a lot of exhausting mental energy to deal with. Ignore 'em and move on.
I've noticed people using these more but I hate them. It's a cultural thing. I'm a New Zealander and y'all sound American redneck to me and folks just sounds weird.
I love “y’all”. It is one of the only things that Texas was way ahead of the curve on. It is gender neutral, easy to say, grammatically correct, and has such a long history that it doesn’t sound forced or intentionally PC.
Y’all is the way. Y’all is the future. Peace, y’all.
As a Australian, I tend to shy away from USAisms as a matter of course, but I 100% agree. English lacks a formal plural form of “you”, and while Australia has its own informal variation (“youse”), I’m a big fan of y’all.
Well, to make a more serious comment instead of just quoting an old song from an old movie, it's definitely most important to call people by pronouns that they prefer. That's the number 1 priority.
That said, I have some trans friends who don't like gender neutral pronouns in general. One in particular has explained how much she has gone through to be able to identify as a woman, and using "they" instead of "she" makes her feel like she still isn't a woman.
So the real answer is there's no one word that will make everyone happy. They best way to do that is to ask people the pronouns they prefer.
English is sorely lacking a second person plural. Y'all fills that gap well and should be adopted over other regional suggestions such as the Jersey youse guys or the dreaded Philly... yinz.
I'd avoid using "dude" as I've heard this specifically as an example that bothered some women.
Y'all is great. I use it often in the North East and only one schmuck ever said anything about it.
Buddy works, but comes off kind of aggressive towards strangers, same with pal or pals, but that may be my own regional affectation showing off.
If you said “I brought some guys back to my place last night”, do you really think people would be imagining a mixed gender group? Do you think they would ever imagine you brought a group of women back with you when you said that? Guys is masculine sometimes used to generalize across a group that includes non-males. It only applies when at least one male is around.
I would probably use gals in your specific example, but personally, I would use guys if addressing a group of girl friends, but that's just how I perceive the word. I guess once you add 'the' or 'some' behind guys, I perceive it as masculine, but it feels totally neutral to me in other contexts, such as "C'mon guys, let's go X!" or "Guys, check this out."
Probably because people have been using it since the 90s for either gender. Same with dude. I was in high school over a decade ago but back then I remember dude and guys being gender neutral, both guys and girls used it that way. Funnily enough this same conversation was happening back then too among my peers, and we all agreed it was already gender neutral at the time.
Coming from a Midwestern state in US, guys, is a very common word. I would say GenX/Millennials use it most, can't speak for GenZ much, or Alpha as I never know what they are saying anyway.
You're asking about a collective and also a singular...
Just in general I'd say that if you're trying to quit a habit around trans women, go the extra mile and quit it around cis ones too. For the collective "hey guys" I have no one-word replacement ("folks/folx" sounds equally southern and somehow more cringe), but you could replace the whole phrase with "hey everybody", "hi gang", "how are you all", or just "hey".
When speaking to any woman, I would advise against calling them "dude" or "man." Full stop. No further thoughts necessary on that one.
I bit the bullet and was the cringy person at work who said "peeps". After a few months of do this, it was amusing to see the word spread until my boss's boss started saying peeps in meetings.
I just omit the unnecessary words or use their name. That works OK, although I'm awful with names so usually it just becomes "Good job!" or "What's up?".
Funny story time: in English I find this is not so bad. In French it's worse. In Vietnamese it's awful. We have dozens of pronouns. They're not only mostly gendered, but contain information about their age and perceived status relative to you. It's a 3-dimensional matrix where the axes are approximately gender, age/hierarchy, and degree of relation (inlaws/blood relations/strangers). You even get a different word for yourself in some of these situations. Then sometimes there's a numerical rank inside each pronoun e.g. male uncle, my spouse's family, 3rd oldest.
The language is already at maximum pronoun burden. Honestly it would just be easier if we called each other 'human' or 'comrade' or 'citizen' or something equally encompassing. It's exhausting as a non-native speaker (and you are not ever allowed to use their names, that's considered super rude).
Whenever there's any question, I usually open with "sup, dogs" in my most serious voice, then continue to deadpan refer to everyone as dog, such as "and you, dog, I need to check the grist mill, thank you dog". Fifteen years in and no complaints so far.
It depends on who you’re talking to. Many people don’t care about saying “guys” as it’s so universal. However, if you’re unsure or meeting new people, that’s where you’d likely want to change it up.
Hey friends! (This can be used for strangers too)
What’s happening my peeps?
Hello everyone!
Hope you both have a good weekend
I sound even more southern than I am because I say "y'all" frequently to avoid gendered pronouns. People, you, and we are often good. I think my favorite is "you folks".
Pacifist as fuck, its a good name then. I don't feel it like man, etc. Even the majority when using it don't think about lebowski.
If i name someone dude, there is more than "man" behind. But I'm maybe wrong ?
Edit : oh sorry realized plurials.
People fine for me, its just an habit to change really. Or hey guys and girls or better, hey girls and guys 😂
But as non English speaker I could use dude for the group, and a my lady for her, if there is an fellow trans with me. Not others ofc.
Will check thé answers for real lol
Mistake ive edited. Bad reading at first. I've respond imgining me self speaking to a dude of me. Not at a group. Individually, no way I call a miss "dude".
So I've seen this a lot, but I'm Gen-X and dude was always masculine to me. I support use of dude as gender-neutral, but it's hard for me to do it naturally because my brain is so locked into dude as gendered.
I live in the northwest and I use y'all and other people I know use y'all and nobody bats an eye. Nobody here says it with a drawl though, it's snappy.
It depends on the group and setting. I use folks and y'all a lot, but don't put a heavy southern drawl on it. Sometimes I say homies or party people. Really, in an unprofessional setting I try about anything I can that could be considered a term to group people. I jumped in a Discord call the other day with two of my buddies already in there and opened by referring to them as bromosexuals. I try to have fun with it but professionally, folks or everyone is what I use most.
I'm just going out on a limb to remind people it's totally ok to say sup man to legit anyone. People that care about that stuff are people you can choose to change it for if you want to be around that type of person.
Dudes is fine - folks and yall also work. I use yall all the time even though I'm now in Canada and have never lived in the US south.
Guys, I think, is still a bit too gender associated but it's borderline. Man is often used in a gender neutral manner but it is very easy to misinterpret and a transwoman could reasonably assume you're trying to troll them.
You've also got fella and feller, I think the latter one is more gender neutral than the former.
I worked at a restaurant in Ohio in the early 2000s. Had a group of ladies come in once, probably in their 50s. Got super offended when I gave the standard "hi guys!" greeting. However, where I grew up, that had become a gender neutral greeting.
If you want to remove gendered pronouns entirely, "y'all" is what I would go with. I think the UK frequently uses "you lot", but that probably does not sound great to most in the US. I suppose "folks" is one that might work, but seems to rub some people the wrong way.
I feel like "guys" is definitely colloquially gender-neutral in most contexts.
"Fireman" is clearly a patriarchic term that literally has "man" in it. In English "firefighter" is commonplace nowadays, but in my native Finnish, a lot of professions have "man" in the term, much in the vein of "policeman", "ombudsman", the Finnish equivalent of "janitor", roughly translated directly as "building/house-man".
We've replaced loads. Most of them are good. Some new terms feel natural and get taken into use, but replacing "man" with "person" rarely works for us without feeling incredibly awkward to use.
So my point is that we can reclaim those terms as gender neutral. Context matters. N-word being acceptable among black people is completely acceptable (and actually a very nice tool for emphasis when properly utilised), and it's even in songs without anyone accusing the artists of racism. (Well, for pop songs at least, no racist hillbilly songs made it to that level.) That being said, it definitely doesn't take away from it's power as a slur if someone uses it in such a way.
So I suggest we'll just use "guys, bro, dudes" as gender neutral and rely that people will understand from context when they're actually used to address men/exclude women etc.
Also, isn't "buddy" sort of neutral already? *goes to check* OoooooOoOooooh, it's from "brother" originally. Guess it's not as neutral originally.