Dave Chappelle fills Netflix special with jokes about trans and disabled people
Dave Chappelle fills Netflix special with jokes about trans and disabled people
It’s the comedian’s first special for the streamer since 2021’s highly controversial ‘The Closer’
Dave Chappelle has released a new Netflix special, The Dreamer, which is full of jokes about the trans community and disabled people.
“I love punching down!” he tells the audience, in a one-hour show that landed on the streaming service today (31 December).
It’s his seventh special for Netflix and comes two years after his last one, the highly controversial release The Closer.
That programme was criticised for its relentless jokes about the trans community, and Chappelle revisits the topic in his new show.
He tells jokes about trans women in prison, and about trans people “pretending” to be somebody they are not.
It's amazing how many snowflake comedians start crying about being cancelled and then go on to have numerous netflix specials about it. Almost like they were never actually cancelled in the first place but they learnt that if they said they were enough times, the terminally dim people who enjoy their material will pay money to see their bully fantasies played out on stage by an old rich guy.
'cancelled' is now simply "people were mean to me on shitter". Their right to express vile horseshit is obviously intact.
Same as it ever was. They always roll out these new words to convey their shock and disgust at the fact that they have to deal with the consequences of their actions.
Love this bit and will upvote it every time.
As seen in these very comments 😂
"Oh sure we can't joke on trans people but you get to swing at Dave Chappelle!?"
This is a good point. These jokes aren't just bad, they're boring. Why not just tell jokes about airline food?
In one of Dave’s early Netflix specials he talks about Bill Cosby and how complicated his crimes were for a black standup who was both inspired and influenced by Cosby as regardless of how shitty he is as a person is a giant of that medium. I sort of feel that way about Dave now, his show and early standup sets were so fundamental to how my sense of humor formed that I can’t completely divorce myself from them, but who he’s become is shameful and i can’t ride with him anymore.
Like fuck him for being so shitty and bigoted in general, but an extra fuck him for letting down the people he inspired and influenced. He’s become the very thing he should have destroyed
Yeah, I'm right there with you. He came up in a conversation over the holidays and I had to go through how in my opinion he had potential to be one of, if not the best, comic of his generation and he squandered it by needlessly punching down and taking oddly vindictive stances. Maybe this is always who he was, but I think the fame and frustration that came with how his career played out changed him.
I can't reconcile the Dave from old interviews and shows with this one, and it's kinda sad.
Unlimited money lets people be who they truly want to be.
Chappelle may have moderated his views early on because he was still trying to "make it," or he may have gotten worse over time, or both. But what reassures me that he's actually just not a good person now is the fact that he can afford to be anyone he wants, and this is who he chose.
You summed up my thoughts well... fuck him
I am so sick of his comedy of grievance. Every act he does over the past few years is about how unfair the world is to him and how people don't acknowledge how great he is.
He's riding out the glory of an okay sketch show that he made two seasons and then torpedoed 20 years ago.
Yeah, I’m reminded of Jerry Seinfeld. Some comedians are great for life, most have a time and a place and excel then and there. I’m the 90s Seinfeld was bigger than big, in the 10s he was telling college campuses they’re too pc for not laughing at jokes about trans people. In the 00s Chappelle left on a high note and was a popular icon of comedy who quit too soon. In the 20s he was a raging bigot who should’ve stayed quit. Meanwhile Larry David is still making tv and fairly popular, but that’s because he mostly sticks to punching himself in the face.
Chappelle has said that Key and Peele were just doing "his show." But look at how Jordan Peele has reinvented himself as one of the iconic horror film directors of our generation (and maybe all time?). He wouldn't be out of place in a list alongside Alfred Hitchcock, Eli Roth, M. Night Shyamalan, Clive Barker, or George A. Romero.
Meanwhile Larry David is still making tv and fairly popular, but that’s because he mostly sticks to punching himself in the face.
I've got a love-hate thing with his writing. David is a master of unconventional suicide by words. He's very funny but so good at causing intentional cringe that I suspect that his humor could be weaponized in the event of another world war.
Seinfeld is a groomer
I remember in "The Closer" he said "now Key & Peele are on Comedy Central, doing my show."
Like dude, you did not invent the sketch comedy show. SNL had been going on for decades before he even thought of doing his own spin on it. I used to like his comedy, but not so much after that special, and definitely not after this.
Dude is a multi millionaire in his 50s who does nothing but bitch about how other rich people "stole" his money. Sooooo relatable Dave, wow!
I mean, yeah, he's a piece of shit, and yeah he's still riding on that old fame, but come on. That was a great sketch show, not merely an ok one. The fact that he has turned into Clayton Bigsby should not distract from the fact that the first episode of his show featured a faux documentary about a black white supremacist. That was some amazing television. I'm all for bashing Dave for the many, many shitty things he's said and done in the past few years, but let's not rewrite history here.
It's far from the worst, but great? I guess there's no accounting for taste. I'd prefer Mr Show, Monty Python, In Living Color, Key & Peele, Portlandia... does Robot Chicken count?
What. The. Fuck.
I've never been the biggest Chappelle fan, but years ago, before he started going down this path, I had basic respect for him as a comedian. Now he's actually promoting punching down? And he didn't feel like he was punching down enough with trans people, so he had to be an ableist as well as a transphobe?
And Netflix would not have put this on their site sight unseen, so they 100% knew that this was a celebration of attacking vulnerable people.
Christ, even when I was in high school I knew that the guy who pushed the kid in the wheelchair over onto their side was a shithead and so did almost everyone else. So basically Chapelle wants his fan base to be the little weasel kid who stands behind the bully with a grin on his face because someone else is getting it when it could have been them.
I wonder if anyone will come in here and defend him with some mumbo jumbo about free speech?
Here he is introducing (and inadvertently humiliating) his friend Elon, who he shares a shocking amount of awful views with:
and chris rock! i was just thinking how these 2 used to be very funny, if not somewhat irreverent... i get it. but now theyre both on this conservative soap box its so weird!
theyve become the anti-carlin!
Carlin is Carlin. Everybody else only tries to approach him or has given up on the idea of doing it. The man had a 50+ year career with a consistent upwards trend. In 4 years we will be at the 20th anniversary of his death. And the man is still relevant and funny to this day.
Chappelle, Seinfeld, Allen, etc. All just hacks who got lucky. Would anyone even know who Seinfeld was without Larry David? That man is another gem for sure.
I can't even watch or recommend others to watch half baked any more between Chappelle and Bruer.
I haven’t heard about Rock. That’s disappointing. It’s a common thing with comedians these days to get upset if their comedy either goes to far or just isn’t funny and blame it on people being too sensitive. It feels like that’s been pushing some of them to the right even though that’s not really the issue they are being confronted with.
A lot of transphobes, white-supremacists, and similar ideologues would support eugenics for disabled people so that isn't a far off description. Whether comedians like him realize it or not, they are normalizing social darwinism essentially.
I wonder if anyone will come in here and defend him with some mumbo jumbo about free speech?
I read a view that not punching down is offensive and not right.
See it's based on everyone being equal and there is nothing wrong with being disabled (the person mentioning this view was disabled). So if you rip on all your friends for whatever, but then don't rip on your disabled friend for being disabled then that is treating them like that can't handle it or that they aren't equal.
Honestly it's comedy, some isn't but most is offensive. Comedy doesn't have to be for everyone but I don't think it should be stopped just because someone doesn't like it. The whole punching up, punching down thing is just weird. It's a self imposed rule people treat like law.
"Everyone is equal, so it's offensive to punch up at a bully without also punching down at their victim" ...is a weird take.
If you think comedy largely has to be offensive and that ribbing your friends is the same as somebody going on TV and saying the same thing, you're missing out on a lot of good comedy. There's so much comedy that doesn't just come down to "saying something offensive for the shock factor."
See it’s based on everyone being equal and there is nothing wrong with being disabled (the person mentioning this view was disabled). So if you rip on all your friends for whatever, but then don’t rip on your disabled friend for being disabled then that is treating them like that can’t handle it or that they aren’t equal.
This comes off like "I can say the N word because I have a black friend and he finds it funny when I say it." Ribbing your friends has the implicit understanding between you and them that it's not ill intentioned or mean-spirited. You could make a joke about your friend's wheelchair, but you wouldn't walk up to a random person on the street in a wheelchair and make fun of them for it. You can make a racist joke with your friends because everybody there knows you're not being serious and you're probably making fun of the people who would actually make a joke like that, but if you go up in front of a bunch of strangers and do the same joke, they don't know that you're not being serious about it. It just sounds like you're being racist.
Punching up and punching down are very specific things, not just joking about a minority group or not; and they're not laws or rules, they're labels for a concept. Calling something a square isn't some self imposed rule - it's just the label for a rectangle that has 4 sides of identical length.
Punching down is specifically when you make jokes at the expense of a minority, rather than making jokes about a minority. It's the comedy equivalent of kicking a kid in the balls because your friends think it's funny. You can make trans jokes without it being yet another "I saw a chick with a dick and that's gross and I vomited" kind of joke. Punching down would be going on TV and making jokes about how black people aren't as intelligent as white people and that's why they're poor and do drugs and end up in prison. Not punching down would be making a joke about how all day people kept coming up to you and telling you how proud of you they are for being brave enough to be yourself and wishing you well in your transition...but you're not trans, you just forgot to put on makeup that day.
Punching up is when a joke is a criticism of a common minority experience at the expense of the people who perpetrate that experience. Like making a joke about how you know that a new black guy moved into town because suddenly everybody is calling you by his name; and when you finally meet the guy, it's like you're already best friends because you already know everything about each other. And then a random black guy you don't recognize shows up drunk in front of your house so you bring him over to your friend's house because you assume he's a friend of theirs - but they had brought him over to your house first because they assumed he was your friend.
Basically, if you have to be an asshole to be funny, then the only people who are gonna laugh are other assholes.
I dunno, there's a couple problems there. You can still punch up or punch down while recognizing that everyone's equal, because we can recognize that status doesn't have to really do with whether or not someone's equal. i.e. someone can be lower or higher status, monetarily, socially, while still being of equal worth, in terms of like, their value as a human. So you can still "punch up" or "punch down", because there's still problems in society, we don't live in a kind of totally equal utopia, or what have you, and to not recognize that and say that we do, and then use that as a justification to be able to punch down, you know, that would be bad.
Oftentimes, the reason people find ire with "punching down", is that it makes fun of people from the perspective of their lack of status and their lack of worth as a human. It's fine to make fun of disabled people, in general, but it's not really funny to make fun of someone who's in a wheelchair, for the fact they're in a wheelchair, most especially if you're not in a wheelchair, because that's punching down. You also see this thing where people who occupy minority positions, like being in a wheelchair, will try to ingratiate themselves to the majority, sometimes with some degree of success, by basically punching themselves in the face socially. "Oh, I'm in a wheelchair, isn't that so funny guys?", but unironically, which negatively impacts, in this example, the disabled, especially as it is used as evidence for being like "hey disabled people are okay with it" or "hey this other guy's okay with it, so if you complain, you're just lame and don't have a legitimate grievance". Now it's their "choice" to punch themselves, but we can also recognize it's arising from their need to try and improve their situation, and the extenuating circumstances, and so it's kind of not that funny in the broader picture, and we also try not to blame them for it on the basis that it's as a result of their circumstance.
You would probably get better laughs and better comedy out of it anyways, if you tried to point out the kind of existential insanity of being someone in a wheelchair, and moving through the modern world, which has not been crafted for you. People in wheelchairs have difficulty using the restroom, for example, because restrooms aren't really laid out for them, so you could maybe come at it from the angle of "why do we still have urinals", or "what the fuck is up with asian squat toilets", or something to that effect. Maybe make fun of everyone wanting you to cut off your legs, and give you robot legs, when really all you wanted was to have a wheelchair that lets you piss and shit, and like, an elevator that isn't broken. The reason chapelle's modern shit isn't that funny, imo, is because he doesn't understand the perspective of trans people enough to make effective jokes out of it. Which, to be fair, is pretty hard to do, if you're not trans. Which is sort of why most comedians don't try it, the same way most white comedians don't try to do racial comedy about black people.
That's not all to overcorrect and say that all his shit in "the closer" was bad, because it wasn't, and he had a handful of good points, but the problem is going to kind of arise when those good points also come with a handful of pretty bad points and pretty bad jokes. Just like his actual show. If I had to wager a guess, I'd say that a good amount of dave chappelle's popularity comes from the double tradeoff of it being extremely popular in the 2000's to kind of be more comfortable with being "edgy" and making fun of black people, on the basis that they're equal, and "I'm not a racist, so it's okay" type shit. People laughing at him, rather than with him, but on the basis that we live in a harmonious post-racial society, barring all of the "weird racists". He even ended up saying as much, as to why he wanted to quit his own show, that he felt people were laughing more at him. The double tradeoff I'm talking about, there, is that he was using the same platform, out the other side of his mouth, to make funny and insightful comedy that pushed the buck. He could attract white people looking to laugh at the minstrel and misogyny, but then turn around and give some good shit on top of it. Even just to portray the reality that black people were still oppressed. Is that tradeoff worth it? It maybe is, if you're able to give good enough insight to kind of balance the rest out, but if the insight is lacking, if the perspective is lacking, then obviously people are gonna be more likely to get very frustrated with it. That's all me talking out my ass, though.
I said it in his last special, a comedian doesn't punch down. Apparently he heard this criticism from others and decided to double down. He's truly become a piece of shit of a guy and I wouldn't be surprised if he's jumped on the Maga train.
"Punching down" also indicates that he thinks he's somehow on a different level from them. So, it should mean, for example, that he's making fun of comedians who are less successful than him. Or maybe it means he's making fun of people who have less money than him.
But, there's likely a trans person out there who has more money than him, so what does he actually mean? He's the one quoted in this special as saying "I love punching down!" Those are his words that he chose. Is he saying that he's inherently better than a trans person or a disabled person?
It used to be popular for white people to think they were inherently better than black people. Talk about a lack of perspective.
Harshly criticizing a powerful group or system (punching up) is considered fair social critique. Harshly criticizing a group or system that is already vulnerable (punching down) is just bullying. It's not about feeling superior in this context, it's just about someone with a huge platform using it to put down people who already have a harder life than they need to.
Pretty sure the whole punching down thing comes from a story he told in one of these netflix specials where a trans woman in a bar told him she likes his comedy but that he needs to stop punching down against her people. He got all indignant about it and tried explaining that it's not punching down because he's black. His logic being that black people are so far down the totem pole it's impossible for any one of them to "punch down" against a different marginalized group.
Him using the phrase now comes across more to me as him reveling in the position that he's, in his mind, been mischaracterized into by the trans community. And less so him actually believing he's better than anyone.
Still not at all a good look. And he's definitely an asshole. The fact that he's still fixated on this one perceived slight that happened to him several years ago should tell you all you need to know about him. My dude has produced multiple Netflix comedy specials focused on getting back at a community he feels wronged by because a woman said something to him once in a bar that he didn't like.
I interpret it as just being a less oppressed class laughing at a more oppressed class. But it does raise a good point.
OR, ya'll are missing the joke entirely, in that he doesn't think he's 'punching down'... nore is he making fun of who you think he is.
In fact, the joke is at the expense of people like those in this thread who are getting bent out of shape taking words out of context. It was tailor made to upset YOU, specifically. YOU, and your unnecessary outrage, are the butt of the joke. He's mocking those who go overboard with the virtue signaling, and you all here are taking the bait hook, line & sinker.
There is a problem right now with self elected 'thought police' trying to remove all discourse, and that is VERY unhealthy for a liberal society. Totalitarianism is not healthy, no matter what your motivation is. Sacred cows are ALWAYS something to be targeted by comedy & satire, and the left wing totalitarianist word/thought police are very much a valid target, every bit as much as the MAGA idiots. For society as a whole, they are equally as dangerous, the end goal is the same but with different underlying motivations.
That being said, the special was lackluster. It felt like he was contractually obligated to give Netflix another special by the end of 2023 but didn't have enough material yet & even what he had wasn't very polished.
I said it in his last special, a comedian doesn’t punch down. Apparently he heard this criticism from others and decided to double down. He’s truly become a piece of shit of a guy and I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s jumped on the Maga train.
it's essential to consider the broader context of oppression when discussing the dynamics of 'punching up' or 'punching down' in comedy. historically, black people have faced systemic oppression, which continues to impact their lives in various ways. this systemic oppression isn't just about individual experiences of racism but also about the overarching power structures that disproportionately affect black communities.
when a black comedian addresses topics related to race, they are often speaking from a place of personal and collective experience with these systemic issues. their humor might be a way to cope with or highlight the absurdities and injustices of these systems. therefore, even when their jokes might seem to target groups traditionally seen as more powerful, it's not the same as 'punching down.' 'punching down' implies attacking those who are less powerful or oppressed, and given the historical and ongoing context of racial oppression, a black comedian making jokes about race or related societal structures isn't an act of punching down but rather a form of social commentary or critique.
Dave Chappelle is the Clarence Thomas of comedy.
Anybody who's followed Chris Rock since the 90s will be familiar. It starts out as an "edgy" black comedian with an overwhelmingly white audience. It ends with your core audience using you as a black voice, that one black friend, who justifies regressive politics. I don't know if Dave is in on the joke, laughing all the way to the bank. Either way, he's playing the clown.
I thought the whole reason he abandoned his successful show was in part a refusal to shuck and jive. Kinda disappointing that he's putting on a minstrel show now.
This is an absolutely brutal takedown of Dave Chappelle
Wow.
He’s not putting on a minstrel show, he’s just voicing out his biases. The Chapelle Show had a subversive and punk edge to it because it made of fun of regressive attitudes about race, what’s happening right now just kind of proves that Chapelle himself was never subversive.
The Chapelle Show had a subversive and punk edge to it because it made of fun of regressive attitudes about race, what’s happening right now just kind of proves that Chapelle himself was never subversive.
I agree with this assessment, but I also have to wonder, based on the percentage of white people who have shown me the "black kkk member" bit, and found it maybe a little too funny, what percentage of his audience was actually in on the joke. It doesn't really matter whether or not he's actually putting on a minstrel show, what matters is whether or not people perceive it as one. Partially, impossible to insure against, but still, something to be conscious of.
As usual, the algorithmic media machine is trying to drum up anger and emotion because that gets clicks and ad views. There were definitely a few transphobic jokes that I was not okay with, but to say he the special is "filled" with them is a bit much.
Also the quote "I love punching down" was clearly not sincere the way he delivered it. I didn't like the special, but the outrage over it is overblown especially considering that putting it in the news will only get more people watching it.
It's called cognitive capitalism. They use the cognitive capacities of the human to grow the capital.
So he is punching down and is telling Trans jokes still? It’s not a percentage issue.
Let's not bemoan specificity. If anything, we need accurate, fine details more than ever.
All the guy said what he disagreed with the portion of the title which stated that the special was "filled" with specific jokes. That particular claim IS indeed a percentage issue.
If you are taking the point further and saying that percentages shouldn't matter, even 1% is too much, that's a SEPARATE claim. It doesn't address the original claim.
thank you!
I'm not sure why people are surprised.
He's always held these opinions, he just hid them among other opinions that weren't as noticeable because he spread the hate around, and mostof the jokes were funny.
This is the same guy that got on his show, and had a segment where a white girl sang his words for him. If you can find the clip without using a service he profits from (I can't right now, it's only available in little "shorts" on YouTube), the whole thing is just him saying shit he doesn't like, that would get his ass "cancelled" if he said them. And the longest segment is about gay sex being gross. Trans issues weren't as visible back then, but the guy has always said this type of thing.
But for some reason, he's stopped doing it to everyone, which is what made it acceptable. He didn't spare any group, but he also didn't target any single group more often than others, except perhaps black people. And it's always acceptable to joke about your own group.
Now, he's just being a douche. The jokes aren't at all funny unless you find it funny to just bash people with no attempt at humor. It has gone far past the kind of abrasive, but exaggerated hate he used to use, but it isn't something new.
But for some reason, he’s stopped doing it to everyone
That's what always happens. It turns out when you're an asshole to "everyone", eventually you're just an asshole to minorities.
Reminder that Reid Hastings the Netflix founder is a prolific anti union and anti public school pact funder. He is a piece of shit outside of giving chappelle a platform
He also literally said "Netflix is not in the business of speaking truth to power" when he censored The Patriot Act with Hasan Minhaj for Saudi Arabia.
What's a "public school pact"? I went to public school and no one ever informed me of any pact!
Fuck! When I saved that orphan from the nobles and someone chanted, "remember the pact" was that what they were talking about‽
I must've been sick that day.
They most likely mean PAC (political action committee), which is just another name for a lobbyist group.
Oh, you must've taken study hall as an elective instead of that Commune With the Old Ones class. I heard it was mislabeled as "Gym Class" so it's understandable.
He's running out of content
Next special:
"What's the deal with Ovaltine? The jar is round!"
"They should call it Round-tine."
Probably.
Comedians doing stand up usually joke about themselves or their lives. Black comedians make jokes about being black. Lesbian comedians make jokes about being lesbian.
Usually when they start joking about other people's race, gender or sexuality, they've run out of material about their own lives and started punching down to keep their career going.
"I love punching down!"
When someone tells you who they are, believe them.
I love that this comes after the special where he said a trans friend defended him saying he doesn't punch down. I guess milking someone's suicide wasn't as successful as he planned so he changed course.
I'm not sure how many of you watched this based on the comments here
But his jokes really were not transphobic in this special at all
Watch the thing with context and see
But as it was happening… I was very disappointed. Because I wanted to meet Jim Carrey, and I had to pretend this n*gga was Andy Kaufman… all afternoon. It was clearly Jim Carrey. I could look at him and I could see he was Jim Carrey.
Anyway, I say all that to say… that’s how trans people make me feel.
That's extremely transphobic and not even an attempt at being funny.
Edit:
“Give me your fruit cocktail, bitch, before I knock your motherf*cking teeth out. I’m a girl, just like you, bitch. Come here and suck this girl’s dick I got. Don’t make me explain myself. I’m a girl”
Also very transphobic, and there's more.
Here's the complete transcript of his new program.
https://scrapsfromtheloft.com/comedy/dave-chappelle-the-dreamer-transcript/
What the fuck this is awful how can you even defend this
Yeah, these aren't jokes which are trying to push a controversial topic mainstream or create a framework for mutual understanding through humor. These are literally just narratives of hate which underpin anti-trans fear politics and actual violence against trans people
“Give me your fruit cocktail, bitch, before I knock your motherf*cking teeth out. I’m a girl, just like you, bitch. Come here and suck this girl’s dick I got. Don’t make me explain myself. I’m a girl”
that's a bruh moment, lol
It does seem better to read the full transcript rather than the whole thing (I have more reading time than watching time) but still not so tasteful. He even says he doesn't want to offend the transgender community anymore, then makes a joke about misgendering himself at a sentencing so he can be the strong man in a women's prison.
Could you give some context? I'm definitely not going to watch it based on just a "take my word for it" argument. He's been known to toe the line and get rude when people call him out on it. At this point I have to assume he is being transphobic simply because that's been a problem for him in the past.
I gave him some context above and he's full of shit. The new program is very transphobic and not just mildly.
Here's the complete transcript of the show
https://scrapsfromtheloft.com/comedy/dave-chappelle-the-dreamer-transcript/
It's awful and not even remotely funny, just offensive. I think he lost his marbles and drank too much conservative koolaid.
Could you give some context? I’m definitely not going to watch it based on just a “take my word for it” argument
Are you actually asking someone else to provide you with a reason to watch the thing you're pretending to have an opinion about?
He basically says, as most comedians have, that you should be able to make fun of everyone.
He says (paraphrasing here) Im not making fun of trans people, they have a lot of representation, I'll punch down on handicapped people instead
It's not about handicapped or trans people, it's about the fact that no matter what you joke about, someone will be offended, and you can't live your life not offending everyone
Also, most of the special was about his dreams as a child, and how other people are dreamers too
He also goes on to give Lil Nas X a lot of props in the special, which if he hated lgbtq people, he probably wouldn't.
The bits about trans people, which were few and far between, were mostly about how people.took and misconstrued his jokes about trans people in previous specials.
I've seen all of them, not once do I think he was specifically targeting and being dismissive of trans people
You can make fun of people without discriminating against them. Dave has pretty consistently made fun of everyone.
He makes fun of himself and his wife for being black and Chinese in this. I don't see everyone screaming that he's racist against black or Chinese people
Last time he came out with a special, I watched it blind, not knowing anything about it. The dude "joked" for 30 minutes about trans people. I cracked a smile once or twice toward the beginning. After a couple of minutes, it no longer felt like he was trying to joke. It was just an old man venting anger. These were not even trying to be jokes.
So why would I give him another chance? Dude sucks now. I'm sure you can tell some jokes about trans people and be funny. But he wasn't trying. And he has a token trans "friend" he uses to justify it all. What a fucking hack. No, I won't give him another chance. He lost me.
Thank you
Context is everything. It's a very well written special especially if you consider the last two.
He's a comedian. If you don't like it, don't listen. It's not hate speech, just comedy. These headlines are trash
Nah, we need to provide rage bait for overly sensitive people
Look, rage bait is literally what social media runs off. Well, that and cute animal pictures.
The upside to Lemmy is that there is less rage bait in general, but we aren't immune to it.
Personally, even if it's not transphobic, it's pretty lame to make that your topic for the entire special.
I'm shocked that Dave Chappelle not only went down this route but has doubled down, especially since he walked from his own show nineteen years ago due in part to the negative racial stereotypes being pushed by the show's execs and the lack of creative control Comedy Central gave him.
And I'm more shocked that Netflix thought it was wise to release another special filled with transphobic drivel, especially since the last one generated so much negative press for them.
If you actually watch it he's not transphobic in it at all
Idk what this article is talking about
The pasted quotations in another thread seem to suggest otherwise.
He walked because he had a mental breakdown...
In his own words a white crew guy laughed at a comedy skit they were filming. Lots of white people watched his show and laughed at the skits
Dave got famous real quick. He played a likable character in Half Baked and next thing you know he was a household name with a giant TV show.
No one really knew anything about what kind of person he was, good chance he was always shitty.
his jokes were always heavily "black people be like this, white people be like that" so he was always a bit overrated. It just sucks he learned so little from his experiences.
I watched both his and Gervais' latest last night out of morbid curiosity. Both were profoundly unfunny. To be fair, Chappelle was marginally funnier than Gervais, whose act seemed like a barely-disguised checklist of right-wing talking points spouted off by a narcissistic man-baby who constantly laughs at his own "jokes" (and seemed like he had a laugh track or just poor audio editing) Chappelle, at least, elicited a few chuckles when he was willing to make himself or th, insanely wealthy (pretty lackluster running bit about the submarine implosion) the butt of the joke. His constant making "joking" about trans, gay, and bisexual people was just not funny.
I think that the root cause of their shifts is that they were always in life for themselves, looking up at the rich and powerful thinking "I want that". So, when they were getting established, the underdog thing was useful. But, they never saw themselves as underdogs but the temporarily-embarrassed millionaires. Once the got their piece, they're right there next to the boomers with the "fuck you, I got mine" attitude to court the favor of those that will reduce their need to give back to the society that they benefitted from. I'm pretty sure neither of them are actually discriminatory in their private lives (they both basically say as much); either they just absolutely lack scruples and are happy to play a shithead to make money and powerful friends or, their pride and ego doesn't allow them to publicly acknowledge fault and not understanding that context and nuance matter (odd to think as they are professional wordsmiths).
I agree to some extent although both of their bits have long been about shock humor and I think they both think this kind of thing is just an extension of that. That doesn't make it funny tho. Shock humor is stale at this point.
It's not that it's stale, it's that they aren't in the same spirit as his older specials.
I haven't seen this one, the last I saw was was his first 2 specials. The jokes fell flat because it didn't feel like they were trying to spread awareness of social issues the same way the older specials did about the police beating negros like hotcakes.
Same with Chris Rock and Luis C.K. Sooooooo not funny. It's like they got infected by some unfunny virus when they did "Talking funny" with Seinfeld. Or it's just really hard to stay funny as you get older. Carlin was amazing all his life but who else? Maybe comedians are like boxers? They don't have an old timers day...
Wait, I thought he already released a special full of trans jokes... Is this another one?
He's released multiple at this point. Guess it really is the hill he wants to die on.
Its probably because people told him not to do it, and he's not gonna let anyone tElL hIm wHaT tO dO.
someone has a fixation...
A fetish, if you will.
He doubled down with this new one, and is appealing to the bottom of the barrel. Wouldn't be surprised if Dave is a low key Trump supporter
Rage bait
He rages...but he saves.
As someone who watched the special I think his greatest crime is just not being funny and thinking he's brave for doubling down. He's a boomer with a fan base and tons of money. If anything, this thread is proof that cancel culture is fake. He's Elon musk if Elon musk used to be funny.
He’s a boomer
Don't forget there are Xers with these views as well, because chapelle's one of them.
You're right, Dave was born in '73, long past the Boomer cutoff point. Boomer is just another easy target to blame this mindset on but like you say this is something that defies generational gaps. I've met quite a few transphobic millennials/gen z-ers and from what I've seen on youngpeopleyoutube, really young kids are already being poisoned by transphobic social media subcultures.
Yup. I have a millennial brother who adopts these same views. Meanwhile I have boomer hippy aunts and uncles far more liberal. I think it would be an error of judgment to just isolate it to a generation. Bad brains is a human trait.
Yeah, he's just another disgustingly rich paranoid angry has-been.
Well said
The funny thing is I have literally no idea who he is. I have to assume he's some American "comedian" who, like most of his ilk, is utterly irrelevant/unheard of outside the United States.
He was a famous comedian who stopped doing his popular sketch show because he didn’t like the way white people where laughing at his race jokes who came back after about a decade and now makes money by making white people laugh the wrong way at Trans people and other disenfranchised people.
He was insightful and hilarious 2 decades ago.
Last thing of his I watched didn't make me laugh once and just felt forced and gross
And then after every joke he does that thing where he slaps the mic on his leg to make a sound to indicate that it’s now time to laugh.
Well that sucks. I like a lot of Dave Chappelle’s comedy and I remember in the special I had watched it a couple or few years ago he was talking about how members of the trans community expressed their thoughts to him as that he was punching down and he ended it with saying he would stop because the trans community is busy fighting for their rights to exist and until he was sure that “we are all laughing together”. I thought that was a very admirable thing to say and for him to see the effect his commentary can cause. I guess that was just him stringing words together that sound good for the product he sells.
He isn't even funny more. For someone who was at his height it's kind of pathetic that the only way he stays in the news is to be edgy now.
They are fighting for their rights to exist which sucks that they have to do that. But they are also fighting for their right to alter children forever and that's fucking crazy.
Puberty changes you forever. Letting a kid who, out of their own initiative, says "I don't want to be a man/woman" take hormone blockers in order to delay their puberty so that they can choose what they want to be once they're an adult is not altering them, but enabling them to make their own choices once they're capable.
Cannot watch him now. For me he has even tainted my fun recollection of his early stuff that I'd liked.
He's not the only comedian broken by transsexuality. Graham Linehan, who wrote father Ted, the it crowd and many other brilliant shows also went off kilter over trans issues.
I won't let that tarnish the earlier work, though, it's profoundly funny.
Not surprised he has all the self reflection of a bigoted comedian being told not to use a slur.
He will be remembered with an asterisk to anything positive he did.
Punching down is never funny. Picking on people who have been marginalized or attacked for being who they are winds up being cruel, not humorous. Maybe a skilled comedian could punch down in such a way that it's funny, but it would be an extremely rare event.
If you want to punch and be funny, you have two options. The first is to punch up. Hit the people in power. Hit the people who have luxury. For example, a joke making fun of poor people isn't likely to be funny. A joke making fun of wealthy people, though? That has a much better chance of being funny.
The other punch style is the self punch. This is where you make fun of yourself or your own "group." For example, I'm Jewish. If a non-Jew makes a "Jews run the world" joke, it'll likely come across as highly anti-semitic. If I were to make that joke, I'd stand a decent chance of getting a laugh. (Well, assuming that I had basic comedy skills.)
When the right complains that the left has ruined comedy, what they really mean is that they can't make fun of people who are suffering without being called cruel.
For example, I’m Jewish. If a non-Jew makes a “Jews run the world” joke, it’ll likely come across as highly anti-semitic. If I were to make that joke, I’d stand a decent chance of getting a laugh
You mean to say that the Jews that run the world have access to exclusive jokes?
Punching down works when it's setting up cultural context for a much bigger punch in the other direction. Bill Burr walks that line pretty well most of the time imo. He'll take small jabs at some low hanging fruit and then the punchline is that he's actually a terrible person and you should feel bad for laughing at him. Sometimes at least. Other times that whole schtick doesn't quite land.
Did Chat-GPT write this?
The other punch style is the self punch. This is where you make fun of yourself or your own “group.” For example, I’m Jewish. If a non-Jew makes a “Jews run the world” joke, it’ll likely come across as highly anti-semitic. If I were to make that joke, I’d stand a decent chance of getting a laugh. (Well, assuming that I had basic comedy skills.)
This is also potentially pretty bad, though. It is a hard line to tread, to make fun of the absurdity of the claim, without, at the same time, validating the premise, for those who believe it, part of why being a comedian is so hard. You have to attract the people who would otherwise believe such a thing, and then illustrate the idiotic absurdity of the claim itself, and you know, the idiocy of the believers of it. You have to make them face it. If you just end up pulling off an exclusive "self-punch", and especially one against "your group", it's very likely to just be accepted/seen as you selling yourself and your group out, in order to validate everyone's preconceived notions, even if that wasn't necessarily your intention. Just like that dude who made a country song a while ago about politicians in washington being shitty, but also being about people on welfare eating cookies or whatever. A conservative narrative got pushed about his song, despite how he wanted, retroactively, for that not to be the case.
Punching down is never funny
clearly you have never slapped a dwarf
on a serious note, you are wrong and your categorization is arbitrary, you are playing joke police.
for example, Ricky Gervais had an entire bit about Caitlyn Jenner, is that punching up or punching down? because Ricky is more famous and maybe even more wealthy than Jenner and also a white male and also didn't kill anyone with his car as far as I know, so that's punching down right? or we is it punching up because we dislike Caitlyn Jenner for her pro-republican stance?
It depends on what they're making fun of in regards to the person. If he's joking about her being trans, that is punching down. If he's joking about her unchecked privileges, that is punching up. Think less about people's identity and more about their needs and then you will get a sense of direction.
I personally don't care for Gervais because he does shit like this and his face and voice make him unable to not be snide about it. He's left a bad taste in my mouth for a while now.
StrawmanStrawperson argument
When is your Netflix stand-up special going to be released?
Basically this.
He's such a culture warrior hack now. Trans jokes? It's getting old bro. Your material sucks.
The culture war must go on otherwise we might start blaming the right people for our problems
Stephen Fry once said that comedy is about punching up. Anyone can punch down, it takes real talent to punch up, you have to make fun of your betters, because they think they are your betters.
Beating on people who are already incredibly socially ostracized is not comedy, it's bullying. If you think it's comedy then you're a bully.
Well, I’m glad I’m closing my Netflix account.
If you don't like it, don't watch it. I've kinda given up on Chappelle. I'm not offended, he's just not really funny to me anymore. I'm sure I'll catch the few funny bits in a YT short soon and that'll be enough for me.
I think that's the biggest crime for a comedian - not being funny. He's just doing the same jokes over and over now, and it's being done by other comedians, too, so it's even more derivative.
Right? Like, you have a single job. If you can't manage that, it's time to retire.
Old man that's not funny and becoming irrelevant got a lot of attention from right wing chuds, so decided to pander to the right wing chuds to try and stay relevant.
He's got a really niche audience. People who think they're all cool just for being "politically incorrect." Like other comedians in the american scene.
I used to like his comedy – great storyteller and all. But lately, it's like his specials follow this routine: some jokes on how racism's still an issue, mixed with a bit of him claiming he's the top comedian alive. And let's not forget the bits where he suggests making fun of people's choices is all in good fun.
The crowd at these specials? Feels like a bunch of yes men, laughing and clapping at every word from Chappelle. It makes watching his stuff on Netflix a bit of a struggle for me.
Don't get me wrong, the guy's talented. Awesome timing and storytelling. But nowadays, being a badass doesn't mean being a bully, and it seems like that shift bugs him and his entourage of yes men. That's probably why his specials come off a bit too harsh, at least in my book.
It's crazy to me that he bitches about racism still being an issue, while he spreads hate and bigotry on another minority group.
He is right about racism, and it’s fine if his cause involves fighting it. But you’re right, bigotry and hate on others is BAD.
This is just NotTheOnion territory at this point
"Man constantly complaining about cancel culture gets a second 2hr special on the biggest platform in the world drawing in huge viewership."
The existence of these type of shows self negate their premise.
I hate that Netflix keeps recommending this to me. No. I don't want this kind of shit.
You aren't missing anything. It's just an hour of an angry paranoid rich guy whining about problems that aren't problems.
This and that fucking Qanon child trafficking movie on Amazon have been on my Google TV all fucking break.
Did Jim Caviezel get worse at acting, or is that movie terribly directed? I don’t really care if the story is exaggerated or largely false, lots of movies are, but he seemed to be over acting a lot.
Do you expect Netflix to have things to watch? That's your first mistake
Yeah that's like all he does these days. The guy is out of material. Like the third or fourth special where that's the main Crux of it. Washed up
If you are disgusted by this and still subscribe to Netflix, you should consider canceling. Vote with your money and hit them in the share price.
Anyone still paying for Netflix after their last round of price hikes is a fucking moron.
Or they just don't care about anyone who isn't like them, which is even worse
“Vote with your wallet” doesn’t really work.
Why does he think about trans people so much? Hmmm.
Yeah i wonder this too. One of my 'friends' is constantly spamming trans hate (he's currently on timeout, blocked on my contacts due to this) and recently mentioned that he never actually met one... What did they do to him??
I know many trans people and with some of them people aren't even aware they are trans. Guess what, they're just normal people.
that's what fearmongering an propaganda does to a gullible person. constantly being told a group of people "are pedophiles" makes you believe it.
i am generally an advocate for free speech, but hate speech like this has nothing to do on the internet.
This is a very valid question. Let the downvoters be mad
I knew this clown was on the decline since his first Netflix special where he has that bit about child molestation and how if its someone like Michael Jackson, it's NBD. Talk about cringe inducing.
His comedy has always been about making fun of essentialism in the way only comedy does (Men are like, Women are like, White people are like, etc).
His problem is that he got mad people were calling him mean and his bloated ego decided the solution was to double down and be mean on purpose. Then he decided he was smart enough to understand the entire project of personal identity (something humans have been concerned about since the beginning of writing and which likely isn’t getting much further without a solution to the mind-body problem) and did some internet research and, after generalizing the experience of two trans people and committing erroneously to the fact that most people would claim to be internally consistent in their beliefs, he decided he’s not even being vindictive anymore, he’s simply understood something true and so he’s allowed to use his (formerly anti-racist) platform to say it.
Anyone reveling in "punching down" is a piece of shit.
Like a shitty band that can't make it, going "christian" for a guaranteed captive audience. If you find yourself not culturally relevant anymore, the bigots will always pay for validation.
Loved his early stuff. This trans stuff not as much.
He's just out of material. It's sad.
Funny at the expense of others is the least funny kind of funny.
Have you never heard a joke before?
Dave is just a weak, hateful little guy now
He found out that getting bad press is better than no press. Like the original thing that got him caught up in the headlines was crass but that's sort of his humor. This one, he's just being a gigantic penis about it and banking on the follow up outrage.
The thing is the anti-politically correct shtick only last so long. At some point it just becomes noise and then you have to up the ante which in turn alienates more people. Rise and repeat till it's difficult to get a booking anywhere but FoxNews.
Like much of anything. It's his career, far be it for me to tell him how to run it. But his comedy routine as of late has just turned resentful and aiming to get as many people to gasp "Oh my, he's such a bastard!" And in reality it just comes off as a big yawn.
I saw it come up and thought I’d wait for reviews. Fears confirmed.
Must be nice to have "fuck you money" and just say insane shit but I won’t support it.
Even funnier than the special is how 90% of the commenters here obviously haven't watched it (or his previous special) and are literally just regurgitating opinions from shitty clickbait headlines like this article.
Haha Dave tickles my funny bone and gets it raging hard
poke the bear...
Nah. More like the bear poking something smaller and less able to defend itself
Think what you like about Dave Chappelle but he only had one joke about raping women. Come on people.
Edit: this comment is so perfectly controversial I can't even guess which people are down voting and which are upvoting.
It was pretty weak if you ask me. I've read worse reddit comments
That's the bar?
No. Reddit is milquetoast and complaining about Dave Chappelle’s sense of humor is the ultimate redditor POV. Only butthurt fascists get bent out of shape about what comedians are saying, we all know he said things like that 20 years ago so why do you care now? People have different taste in comedy just like they have different genders so I don't see why he's not allowed to have an opinion according to internet users. Is it because he's black?
.... its .. not ok... to ... tell... jokes... about... certain... people ?
Punching down is the problem.
Also the whole "my brother is an asshole but if you call him that I'll punch you" thing.
If he was making jokes about a community he was involved with at all, great. If it was a trans comedian making these jokes, (probably) great.
But this is just another old out-of-touch rich guy making fun about people who are already having a shitty time (on average).
Also, notice how anyone has yet to actually forbid him from doing it. He's not being "cancelled/consequenced".
A lot of people just find it extremely distasteful. (It hasn't slowed him down in the slightest.)
I don't think it would have blown up if the original joke was good.
But it was just "this person called themselves a woman but had a cock".
And then pulled the "I have a trans friend" card. Like Dave of all people should know better than that. He seems to want to be the Bernard Manning of trans jokes.
Depends... on... whether... the... joke... is... malicious,.. of... course.
It's absolutely ok to tell jokes about marginalized communities
They just need to be good jokes
I liked this video
Oh, that was actually good.
in the quiet, the real quiet of it all, after the yelling and flaming on the internet, we have two types of thought. One that thinks that people have both the ability and the freedom to say what they think, out loud, and even to entire groups of people. And we have a group of people that thinks we are all safer and happier if we don't let them. That group also thinks we have to agree (with them), they say one word a lot, 'tolerance' but curiously they mean that in one direction: the direction they identify with. In the same way, they falsely equate :"disagreeing with me" to "hating me".
You can disagree about favorite football teams or ice cream flavors. If you disagree about my right to exist, then that is, in fact, hating me.
Tolerance is a social contact. We are under no obligation to be tolerant towards the intolerant: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance
This makes his losses even funnier to me. I remember when this moron never got paid for his first show because his lawyers fucked him over on his contract.
I’d had felt sorry for him if he wasn’t such a vile racist.
What a clown.
The Independent knew what they were doing.
They take a couple of his lines completely out of context, put it in a headline, and people can't wait to post a comment about how much they hate him.
I wonder how many of you have been given your opinion of him and never actually watched him?
I will definitely admit this latest special was "meh". But man, I'm pretty confident most of the commenters here have strong opinions of this special without ever watching it.
This thread reads like a bunch of Boomers were given a headline that "Biden paid for coke that Hunter snorted off hookers butt, in the Whitehouse.", and couldn't wait to post how much they hate Biden and that he's a criminal, or whatever.
okay, so you watched him and i didn't (got rid of netflix a few years ago).
did he make a bunch of jokes about trans people and people with disabilities? what's the context you got that i need to more accurately understand this performance?
edit a word
I'm not going to defend or attack him.
I would have to do half his routine for the context to work and I am not interested in doing that.
But just think, for a moment, about all the stupid shit boomers say, believe, and respond to, from just a headline. When they do it, you get frustrated and angry for them going off, half cocked, over nonsense.
Then realize, you are responding the same way. Not the same beliefs, mind you, but letting yourself get riled up about what someone else said about a third person.
Crap like this article is written solely for people to have an emotional response to it. They are monetarily motivated to do it. Revenue is driven by Internet traffic and ad clicks.
The reason data is so valuable is because they know what you react to. They see what generates that visceral response and then generate/tailor content because it drives viewers and clicks.
Take it a step further and you can see how it is used to generate political support and sales.
Don't let yourself get manipulated by an online article.
I am NOT telling you to like Dave Chappelle or that he's a good guy. I am telling you that the responses here, on this post are exactly why it is being done. Both his standup AND the way the article is written.
Dave Chapelle was never funny. I hope he does something actually funny like drive his car into a telegraph pole.
yeah it's called comedy
Ha, yeah Dave's great.
ITT: People who suck out all of the context and humor out of a joke and then insist it was never funny (even though the dude sells out arenas and everyone laughs and he's widely considered by comedy fans and other comics to be a living GOAT). Comedy is democratic. You can't say the stand up comedian is this or that, because he is telling jokes.
Comedy is part of a conversation, all art is, an artist is using their medium to say something. He has a massive platform and he is choosing to encourage even more hate against trans people. Even if his jokes about it weren't so played out and dumb there are endless things he could joke about. It's an asshole move and he chooses this topic probably because he knows it riles people up, because he is lazy and has nothing better to joke about.
He is one of the GOATs if you look at his history and he probably can still make good jokes about better topics if he chose to. Massive assholes have had huge crowds plenty throughout history, it just proves that plenty of people are dicks too.
You can't say the stand up comedian is this or that, because he is telling jokes.
Yes you can lol
He wasn't hired to read a script. He wrote and rehearsed the jokes he chooses to tell
Does that mean Anthony Jeselnik is a literal Nazi because he wrote jokes about the Holocaust and being the grandson of a Nazi? Or that Don Rickles was really an asshole for being an insult comic?
I do think Dave is bigoted, but I don't agree with this particular argument since insult comics and offensive comics don't have to believe the dark shit they write for the sake of humor. It's what Dave says and does off stage that shows he actually believes the shit he says.
To be fair, Just because poeple Like it doesnt mean it is good. Hitler was elected too. Im Not saying he is a bad comedian, i dont know him. I Just think the Argument "it is good because its popular" ist Bad.
I see. My argument here is more like "many diverse groups of people basically unanimously had the same involuntary reaction to the jokes, therefore the jokes are funny."
If I show a steak to a room full of people and 99% of their mouths water, we can safely say that the steak is appetizing.
My other point is when you strip away from a joke the context, innuendo, voice, and attitude, or you go in prejudging the comedian, you have so altered the material that it cannot be fairly judged.
I've seen all the specials and he's never struck me as any sort of bigot.
By that logic, your comment having more downvotes than upvotes means it's a bad take.
He sells out arenas because there are a lot of assholes who think his bigotry is funny. Or people who didn't realize he was gonna keep on that line and left disappointed.
considered by comedy fans and other comics to be a living GOAT
I hope someday people go back and look at all of these goats in their writing that aren't referring to farm animals and wind up with the greatest cringe of all time.
EDIT: Seriously, "GOAT" is a stupid acronym that I blame crappy sports punditry for...people sound like idiots saying it.
"HEY EVERYBODY! FUCK CHAPPELLE! AM I DOING IT RIGHT?! CAN I FIT IN, TOO?! PAY ATTENTION TO ME!!!"
You figured it out. People don't really hate bigots, they just want to conform.
Ehh. I'll probably still watch it.
Netflix appreciates your support for bigotry and is glad that you will be added to the data that shows that bigotry makes for popular programming. Otherwise, we might not make this sort of thing anymore.
His flavor of comedy is offensive comedy. That's what made him successful. That's why I like him. He tells jokes based on what his opinions are. I don't recall him asking anyone to adopt his thinking.
I'm baffled as to why you would even think we didn't realize that his jokes were based on his atrocious opinions. His opinions are what is the problem. Let's say there is a white comedian that tells endless jokes about black people because that's what his opinion is and his flavor of comedy is offensive comedy. And then in the special, he comes right out and says, "I love being a racist." Why would that comedian be worthy of Netflix money?
Or is being ableist and transphobic more acceptable than telling jokes that are racist against black people? What if it's jokes about Jews? Would that be okay? Which marginal group should Netflix draw the line at when it comes to funding comedy specials?
He also tells jokes that are offensive to Jews and black people. Yes, it's his brand, but it's a horrible brand. He continues to double down on his shock comedy and he doesn't care who he hurts. Trans people are being murdered because of who they are, and when a public figure publicly spreads hatred against them it adds gasoline to that fire and makes the world less safe for people who are trans.
I don't really care if a comedian is offensive, but in this case it's actually dangerous.
That’s an amazing skill to separate the comedy from the opinion, or do you agree with his opinions, too?
Nobody, practically, asks to “adopt their thinking”. It’s implicit by taking a public pulpit like this. One doesn’t get on stage unless they want to be heard. He isn’t a victim of his own success. Humor is a completely viable path to social and political commentary.
You don’t have to ask because people by and large don’t choose their beliefs. They are mostly indoctrinated into them via rationalization of inherent biases and other environmental factors. How many Muslims are born into FLDS households in Utah?
Overt bigotry and marginalization gives cover to viewers’ rationalization that it’s okay to have thoughts of discrimination against outgroups.
Classic Schrodinger's asshole. Say whatever you want and if anyone questions you about it, you were joking!