Joe Rogan Nods Along As Mel Gibson Claims His Friends Were Cured of Stage 4 Cancer By by ivermectin, fenbendazole (another animal dewormer), and methylene blue (a fabric dye)

In the beginning of Covid, a doctor in very rural India started treating Covid patients with ivermectin and they got better. So the doctor wrote a paper about it, and this paper was touted as proof that ivermectin was the cure for Covid, and nowadays everything.

Because schools don't stress science literacy, what people didn't notice in the paper was that WHY ivermectin helped these patients with their Covid infections is because they ALSO had multiple parasites because they were living in a very rural area and rarely sought medical help, and therefore their immune system was already overburdened dealing with the parasites. By treating the parasites with ivermectin, their immune systems were able to focus on Covid and actually fight through it. This was all explained in the paper, people just didn't read past the title, clearly.

Ivermectin is prescribed for humans - specifically in the cases of parasites. We need to get back to teaching science literacy and critical thinking in schools.

I know it started with COVID, but to become a wonder drug…

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3043740/

It garners it's "wonder drug" status long before COVID. Just not for any reason related to COVID. Nor Cancer...

Scam artists can sell it without a prescription as long as they're calling it an animal product. It's sold off the counter at any feed store. This is always the scam with these claims it's ''it cures cancer THEY just don't want you to know about it!'' Then they sell you a huge amount of it at a huge markup. This is everything from Monavie (an aqci berry juice), vitamin Mega doses, some completely insignificant ''supplements'' (I knew a guy selling ox bile capsules with almost no oil or extracts mixed in), then you have all manner of crystals, jade eggs, food processing leftovers like apricot pits, inert nonsense. And I'm not even really mad about it because it mostly ripps off rich idiots like Mel and Joe. These idiots take the same meds from their doctor as everyone else, then ALSO take the snake oil and are convinced the snake oil worked. Joe took a vit C mega dose when he was also taking meds from his doctor for Covid, and he's SURE the Vit C did something. It's like how if you have really worn out tires on a car that when you get new tires the mileage gets noticeably better, but then you think ''tire store change tire = 20% lower mph'' so you take your car back the next day and ask them to change the tires 4 more times because you think it will make your car have -100% gas consuption. All these meds CAN improve your immune system response by removing parasites if you have them, eliminate vit deficiencys if you have them, or remove other micro nutrient deficiencies, all work IF you have the issue to begin with, and studies show the improvement, but taking 1000x the dose of Vit C is just making your pee insanely vit rich, once the deficiency is resolved your body dumps the excess.

But they'll kick and scream and run away from the actual medical miracle with a medically tested and proven vaccine.

I dunno how the hell I could tell from back in the day, watching movies he was in, that I couldn't trust him. Just something about the way he acts. I can't put my finger on it.

Did he ever win an Oscar? Did he leave it in his house? I bet he didn't see that one coming.

Yes and it treats fungal infections in tree frogs. I'm not trying to say that these medicines work the way that Gibson is saying they do, but the whole "horse dewormer" talking point is dishonest as it makes it out like these medicines have only a single use. I doubt ivermectin treats covid or whatever. But anytime someone just throws out these minimizing points as if it's impossible to use things in more than one way only makes me doubt the validity of their claims.

Yes but californians first

I can believe that, but thinking a thing that's helpful in spinal surgery then taking it when you have the cancer is... it's pretty fucking dumb. Like... penicillin has saved my life about 5 different times because I have had chronic pneumonia, but I'm not about to down it if my leg breaks. These aren't similar issues.

Huh. Apparently it's been found seemingly helpful with pain management, trauma reduction, disinfection, cleaning, and tumor detection when used as a dye. I wasn't thorough so I didn't find anything about spinal reconstruction specifically but its use is probably related in one of these ways in some procedures. So TIL.

Still not a cancer-killer. Sorry, Mel!

Calling it a horse dewormer came about because folks were buying the ones labeled as deworming agents at tractor supplies and similar locations. Sure it has other uses but its an easy jab at the folks drinking it like water for covid.

It is approved for use in humans, but its primary uses are all as an antiparisitic drug. And primarily worms.

Nobody is claiming that it isn’t great for deworming horses and other related anti-parasitic applications. But it is provably not effective at combating COVID or cancer, and mocking people who conflate the legitimate uses for the imaginary uses under the guise of “its a WHO essential medicine” is morally correct.

Everytime I hear it introduced as "horse dewormer". The bias is already made clear.

While Mel Gibson is clearly off his rocker in that Ivermectin can't do jack shit against cancer... So is OP for acting like it's not safe for human consumption. It's safe for consumption even at 10x a "normal" dosage (with all the Covid-19 studies showing that while more or less ineffective for COVID, not at all harmful otherwise at up to 3000μg/kg.... or 15x a typical dosage http://ssrn.com/abstract=3714649).

IVM has been used safely in 3.7 billion doses worldwide since 1987

It's 100% safe... and boatloads of it have been given to humans for longer than most people arguing about this shit have been alive.

Source: https://www.eurekaselect.com/article/41838

TL;DR... While probably useless for anything that people recently attribute to it... It's safe for consumption as a general rule.

While they also claim to be skeptics of drug manufacturers and only want all-natural shit! It’s ridiculous!

Pushing an agenda usually has that effect

I’m sorry, but fuck free speech as so many people are raving about. Its the worst thing that has happened to the world since the Internet came on.

I think the mistake isn't free speech but not having enough exceptions for fraudulent statements. For example, if you say anything false and damaging about a specific person, everyone agrees that's libel and not "free speech". But if you say something false and damaging about a group of people, like trans people or immigrants, that's "free speech" and perfectly legal. Or if you say something false and damaging about fake cures, etc.

It's actually a tough problem because we can't expect everyone to just be perfectly right all the time. But I think that for people like Rogan who have a wide platform, there should be some liability for lying about things that actually harm others. The fact that this is effectively legal is why psychopaths are dominating media narratives right now.

how can anyone agree with free speech being the worst thing to happen in the world since the internet. seriously, how can anyone read that and agree?

the worst thing to happen in the world since the internet.....is free speech...... please read what you are saying BEFORE submitting a comment. good lord. if there was a lemmy worst of that single line should be pinned to the top

Bruh... That's some high hopes and a fuck load of effort for something that will never happen. Your suggestions are very much unrealistic.

Please let's do that. Half of Lemmy would go to jail and the other half straight to the death row

and people form some stupid reason just lap it up

Stupid people love being stupid. Ignorance is bliss, after all.

Well, unfortunately, this is only going to get much worse when Trump takes over..

I think you listed several good points. I believe a government that actually cared about its populace would help to protect people from propaganda. The problem is that this would require a government that was actually just. That is not what we have in the US at least.

I always think about it simply because it helps weed out what is really going on. Listen, if go to your doctor and they purposely give you bad advice they could be on the hook for it. They have licensing boards, oaths, insurance, and legal regulation to prevent them from saying things like horse dewormer good.

Why is it when we have influencers, talking heads, and politicians who can do much much more harm than one doctor giving bad advice allowed to operate without oversight, licenses, regulations, and ignore their obligation to society?

Let's go back to simplifying this again. You would not tolerate someone in your personal life that lies and decieves you. Now think about people in authority. Would it be okay for your teacher, your coach, or your boss if they lied to you and manipulated you. They would lose their jobs if they did this and others find out.

We understand because of psychology and human nature that it is very easy to manipulate people and abuse them. That is why we hold the leaders close to us to high standards. Strangely though the more power people accumulate the less we seem to hold them to these standards when in fact we should even be stricter.

To be frank the reason we are not holding our most powerful people responsible is because they have been allowed to set the narrative. There is very little influence independent media has compared to mainstream media. If mainstream media creates an environment where it is just expected that politicians lie and are corrupt then everyone accepts it.

This is most definitely a conspiracy. Ever since propaganda became public relations we have seen those in power increasingly abuse their privileges. They have fine tuned the narrative to prevent themselves from being called out for the lies and damage they cause

They are using the best of psychology and other sciences to manipulate people. Drive their fear and hatred playing them like a marionette doll. We would never allow a partner to abuse us in this way but we allow someone who is way more powerful than a partner do this.

And make no mistakes these politicians are just like a partner because they are making intimate decisions about your personal life. They are invading our homes telling us what can and can't do reproductively. They are threatening people's livelihood. They are pitting Americans against each other for their own ends.

We need a new constitution that spells out that we will no longer be allowed to use the best of technology and science to manipulate people for selfish ends. We need rights to privacy, safety, and accountability. Until we grow up and stop allowing ourselves to be abused things will not improve.

The government must be designed to resist corruption not embrace it. Our current system is beyond broken with its winner take all two party nonsense. This binary choice is not a choice at all. You could never account for the diversity of thought and opinion with a choice between only two entities.

All of this is by design of course as the US was founded by the rich for the rich. I don't know about you, but this is unacceptable. We have a cancer destroying our society and mainstream media pretends it does not exist because they part of that cancer.

We have lost the proverbial battle so far in the 21st century, but that does not mean we can't demand change. The war for our future is not over yet. Don't let people fool you either. Change can and does happen and until we demand it we will continue down this path of lies and deception.

No facts for you. Only alternative facts!

Wait. Can we solve this by sending Joe and Mel a crystal growing guide?

I have some green food coloring in the pantry. Will that help with hemoroids?

Its like slightly worse than talking to marxists

Except death itself. How ironic. /s

Death is the ultimate cure for cancer.

Ever head of dim mak, buddy?

I am always disheartened when I see his podcast is always at the top of the charts, even left leaning reasonable friends i know listen to it

🎵Help the people the thing that happened happened toooooo 🎤

I guess he'll get to blame the Jews for that one again.

This is some of the best news I've heard all day.

I know there are fires there, but it sure is a coincidence his house burns down while Mel has a airtight alibi being on Rogan's show.

Probably something to do with all that ivermectin.

Drugs

Sadly he's on a late stadium of being a cunt

Cocaine

As if he only has one house

Don't get too excited, there's insurance for houses

That's his god fucking him up

https://youtu.be/rUxzaQrOAOA?si=reRstbpsi0fpMI7a

The horse dewormer thing iirc comes from the fact that ivermectin is a prescription drug, and doctors obviously wouldn't prescribe it for covid. So people resorted to one of the very few ways you could still purchase it: as the horse dewormer variant.

Of course this version is much stronger and intended for horses, not humans. IIRC this led to a few hospitalisations and even deaths.

That's why when people advocate you should take ivermectin, the counter claim is that they're telling you to take horse dewormer, since that's the only way to get it. It's not out of a general 'disrespect' for ivermectin.

It actually is something of a wonder drug

And it worked wonders on COVID patients who actually had parasites in the "throw everything at the wall" period. Word got out some patients had improved because of it. It became a whole thing because doctors didn't got the same results with ivermectin in others trials, probably because their patients didn't have parasites, and ruled it out as the COVID cure. Arm chair viral experts refused to believe it and made it a conspiracy, and from there on became a cornerstone of anti vax and right wing politics. Of course right wing commentators now make it the cure for cancer.

People are literally buying it from Tractor Supply when doctors won't prescribe it. That's why people say horse dewormer. It is literally horse dewormer they are taking.

I personally know/knew one of the main guys promoting Ivermectin in the news and on rogan. It was 100% a grift and he knew it. The point wasn't the medicine but subverting public health efforts. That is why it is derided as horse dewormer.

The fun fact about Methylene Blue that always is a hit with students is it also turns your pee a green/blue-green color.

This should be the top comment. Most conspiracy bullshit always has some grain of truth, so when you dismiss it with factually wrong information you just solidify the conspiracy mindset, since you "don't get it".

The best way to fight conspiracy theories is to engage them head on and make them prove the claim. They'll try and miserably fail IE flat earth.

Yes, but invermectin is also a very strong drug and even for its intended uses, it's rarely recommended to take it more than twice in a year. During covid days, people were taking it weekly.

Same with ketamine, horse tranquilizer. Also a powerful fast acting anti depressent among a other very positive qualities

Thank you for this. I hate all the caveating you have to do on the internet, but this taught me something I didn't know and now I'm slightly less of an idiot :)

It's because they buy the veterinary products as a way to circumvent existing reasonable limits for human use of ivermectin. It's implicitly against doctors' recommendations and prescriptions.

Alternatively, they're buying ego-boosting pills/pastes that feed the fantasy that they're special/chosen people who are in the know about "secrets hiding in plain sight" like a common antiparasitic drug having incredible curative properties.

Propaganda and conspiracy usually work better when they have a bit of truth to them.

Yes it led to the first TB treatments or something didn't it? I completely can't remember, does it also have a link to the development of antidepressants? Somebody help me out, my undergraduate degree was a long time ago now.

Edit: oh yeah, it's a MAOI, you literally wrote that in your post.

Don’t even get me started on that fucking telepathy podcast

tribe of fuck wads

You realize you’re talking about 80 million people?

But I hear the horse paste is apple flavored!

Fwiw, certain trained professionals who are licensed to practice recommend ivermectin in certain situations.

Methyl blue I heard one talking about how it's interesting and they are evaluating it.

The ones I know are rabid leftists, who hate Trump, fwiw

That reminds me of some obscure bit of dialogue in some scifi show or something, where someone tries to insult another person by something but then they're not offended, just autistically go "brains are supposed to be wet" for something.

Ugh it's not wet though but something along those lines. Ugh this is gonna bother me all day

Edit only took 5 hours, wasn't scifi. My brain is soft and wet.| Brooklyn Nine-Nine RIP Andre Braughr

Was gonna say he wouldn't have to nod along if he didn't talk to the crazies, but then I remembered it's precisely what he's getting paid such absurd amounts to do.

I'd probably just not have a crazy old man as a guest, but hey ¯\(ツ)/¯

Yeah, while I don't doubt Rogan would swallow it hook, line and sinker; just nodding along is what most people would do with someone that's a guest but batshit crazy.

I know it's dangerous, but it's important to at least tell them people ignoring them aren't silently agreeing with their bullshit. So, if you think you can manage the risk, you should tell them.

He can later edit that part tho

To be fair, Mel Gibson has been a racist, homophobic piece of shit for decades now. The fact that he's waded into right wing conspiracy and grift, should be a surprise to no one.