People doing the 30 days linux Challenge are having several problems because of Mint's old packages and technology. Why people still recommend it when there is Fedora and Opensuse with KDE and Gnome?

It's understandable when it comes from niche programs with solo devs. You are likely to be a degen when you spend your whole day in front of your computer. So you likely also have degen habits like the one here. But if it's from group of devs then yeah that's straight up irritating.

Also you in the sense not you. English not my main language.

Yes I do

I would have to disagree. What you are saying is toxic communities that reply RTFM to every question like arch or gentoo. Those aren't beginner friendly distros. Mint, ubuntu, pop, fedora all have wonderful communities and quick support.

Windows is more documented. Not better but more. So when someone migrates to linux they panic because they can't find resources like they used to do. How to fix this? Just give it time. More windows enshittification, more migration, more questions in support, more answers. No more gstekeeping like feeling.

Lol source pls

What features were lacking from mesa or Cinnamon generally?

I have 4k 1440, 1080 monitor (120hz or higher) on Mint edge, what would I gain from switch to somethibg else?

stay away from debían stable or slackware then....

Newer kernels are available, they even have a gui for it. Why would a Cinnamon user care about KDE or GNOME updates? (Some of which are broken on Fedora, like rdp login)

Mint Debian can run 6.7 right now.

I think Mint is mostly for the "I have a PC that’s a few years old and want something easy and reliable to replace Windows with" crowd. Because it works great for that. It’s the perfect beginner distro.

I'd give it a shot if i was on the lookout for something new, but I see absolutely no reason to switch from Mint.

I wouldn't quite go so far as to say it's gone "mainstream" since you still have to be moderately nerdy to know about it. I get your point though. This is one of the reasons I am so happy the Steam Deck exists. Before Valve released the Steam Deck nobody wanted to make games for Linux, so Valve said "fuck it, we'll do it ourselves" and proved it was not only possible, but a better experience overall. While not all games work, having 78-80% of your game library work on Linux, with no Windows OS performance tax, is a great experience. Even with the Proton compatibility layer games generally run faster than on Windows.

Not even close to approaching mainstream!

If you have to tiptoe around to use it "correctly", it doesn't "just work"

I'm pretty sure I'm the only person in my circle who even knows what Linux is.

what do you think about:. "you don't need to choose one" and "you don't need other people to choose for you" and "distro isn't that important in many cases"

I can agree 100% on what distros I use for what types of computer. And I can agree 100% on what I'd have used now, if i were a beginner again.

But all i can recommend to a stranger is, backup all your stuff properly,

try a few out (v.m. or liveCD/Ventoy) and be prepared to change.
make sure to check application versions in the base software repository - for any programs where that matters to you. and ease of updating - if that matters to you. and check out some flatpak if you think that might be a useful way to get extra applications or in some cases up to date.

if in doubt, choose gentoo /s

The thing is, I don't care to distrohop and experiment with this or that. I just want to use my computer. Until I see a distro that can convince me that switching will be actually painless (not 'long time linux user painless', but 'casual new user that does more than just web browse' painless) I'll just use windows.

Ubuntu isn't the most popular and hasn't been for a while. It actually has a lot of issues new users are likely to run into, including lots of spurious error messages. Apparently the top 5 according to distro watch is: MX Linux, Mint, EndeavorOS, Debian, and Manjaro.

So essentially debian, arch and ubuntu derivatives.

They have a fairly new version called Edge that ships with a newer kernel (currently 6.5).

But it's not randomly frozen, it's tied to Ubuntu's LTS builds. And they didn't say "stable" is the same as "works well", they said Mint is both (which is true from my experience at least)

If you need newer packages with Mint, Flatpak is a good way to go (yes it has its own issues, but they do work well for a lot of people)

You said the bad word that hipster Linux boi's don't like. I rarely have trouble our of Ubuntu. I've slowly eliminated most of the snaps. But its not cool for it to work. It has to be hyped. This is what they can't stand.

Ubuntu is a lot of things but it isn't snappy

It usually has something to do with programming. Again, most cases, the versions in the packages included in your garden variety stable distros should cover most use cases.

However, once in a while one would encounter the need of using the cutting edge features on certain compiler or interpreter. Rust comes to mind. I know Python introduced some features that could drastically alter workflow (e.g. switch statement). NodeJS is another one known to be lagging behind from time to time.

In other cases, hardware support might be taken to consideration, especially for newer machines. However, with Mint including the optional newer kernel, it shouldn't be a problem.

Modem hardware.

The default kernel Mint has installed isn't new enough to support cards like the 7900 XT. Though this can be fixed by updating the kernel using Mint's kernel version utility

The only major issue I ever had with mint running relatively old packages was when I got my current laptop. Nvidia 4060 required a really new nvidia driver, which in turn required a really new kernel. I sorted it out by adding a few unofficial repos, and it worked like a charm afterwards.

Whenever old versions are giving you grief, they can usually be sorted out in a similar manner.

Hmm vim is the reason I dropped all debian based distros. Cause I wanted v8 when it was released but sorry you have to wait 2-4 years. Wasn't in the mood for compiling it myself so just went with arch based distro and haven't looked back since.

Good for you.

I learned a really strange (yet rather obvious in hindsight) lesson a week or so ago. I recently deployed Apache Guacamole at work for webby access to an RDP box with MFA. We are dumping MS's RDG because it is not very flexible and is really complicated. One of my younger members of staff uses it whilst in the office and are almost pathetically grateful for me setting up the Guacamole thing 8) (WTF).

She's an Apple aficionado. She can now use her Apple thingie as St Jobs intended and also connect to work stuff, which is largely Windows and Linux based but the Linux stuff is abstracted away to the browser.

The key point is that she considers herself as an Apple person for want of a better word and can be an Apple whilst using our corp MS and Linux gear and it appears to her that it is all integrated.

I'm 53 years old and have been doing IT for around 30 years. We really have to get to grips with how people think and work.

If you want a non-gaming alternative to Bazzite to recommend, there's it's two universal blue siblings, Aurora (general purpose desktop) and Bluefin (silverblue/workstation distro). They both have the same setup as Bazzite but without the explicitly gaming elements. https://universal-blue.org/

I love Bazzite. It's now my daily driver on my laptop and Stream Deck! It just works.

Bazzite is broken AF on Nvidia right now, with no X11 and no explicit sync driver. I can't wait to see if driver 555 fixes it.

Edit - 555 is out, and yes it is considerably better.

Yesss! My first five minutes with OpenSuse.

I mean, you can change that behaviour somehow. But there are so many other small things like the constant vendor changes. Zypper is just so quirky. It's a cool distro and to have a rolling release option like tumbleweed is always a big plus in my opinion, but I just wouldn't recommend it to people who are not really eager to play around with their distro.

Maybe you should have clicked on 'nvidia repository' in Yast. That's pretty much all there is to it.

It never ceases to amaze me how out of touch tech enthusiasts are. How much does your average person know about their car? That’s how little they know about their computer.

They might not know what an OS even is, or how to identify where “Windows” ends and applications begin. They do what they bought it for, and if that doesn’t work, they take it to someone who knows how to get it working again. They know how to charge it, and to plug in a headset or USB key or something. If that functionality doesn’t work automatically or they encounter any issue, it might as well have exploded in their hands.

There are people who have been using Windows for 30 years that know literally nothing about it. Putting a “years of experience” metric on it is hilarious. It’s like assuming that if someone has been driving for 50 years that they know anything about cars besides how to drive it and where to put the gas.

Windows users have a variety of different skills and experience. I guess the most likely ones to try Linux first are not going to be the PC-fearing ultra-causal users, who probably follow what their friends do. But the more adventurous and curious ones, or IT workers.

Even if Fedora has a spin with the same DE, from my experience, Mint/Ubuntu still has a higher chance just work on a given system.

I love Fedora and use it pretty much exclusively, but the out of the box experience of Mint and Ubuntu is still a bit better for the average user imho.

This was news to me as well, but I assume that the Arch Linux logo in question suggests that it might be strange to use an Arch Linux specific illustration, for something that isn't mentioning Arch Linux.

Did that clear it up, or were you just being rude?

Arch is absolutely divine with its documentation. There is a bit of a "you must be this tall to ride" with them though. Like the tiny [AUR] link. That's not really well explained, and is even more opaque if you follow the link.

"not that hard" is the kind of glib, conceited thing that keeps lots of new people from joining the community

1. How does one contribute asshole?
2. How does said asshole help?

If it doesn't provide a benefit for them, why should they bother? I understand why a teenager would, I would have as a teenager. But as an adult? Who got time for this?

Gentoo was my second linux Distro ever some time in 2003 or 2004.

Installed it by printing out the full install doc, which was like 30 or 40 pages, and starting up a stage one install. I got through the entire install by following the instructions because the documentation was that good.

I remember having a problem and hopping on an irc chat to ask for help and people there being baffled about the basic level questions I was asking while having a working Gentoo install.

Gentoo is good at explaining how system works.

Why shouldn't VR work without Novidia?

It does some weird formatting to the usb stick. You literally have to use their tool to unformat it again otherwise it's screwed. That's been my experience.

I had an issue on my MacBook bios safety installing Fedora. Wouldn't boot and even if I tried installing Ubuntu over it, still would not boot.

Had to reinstall Mac OS and have it repair the bios. Only after that could I get Linux installed and booting again.

I don't know how they screwed it up but they did.

thanks for the clarification. I just recently got into linux and don't know much, but as i was researching Fedora, that's what i came across. Which is a pretty big turn off for a newcomer migrating from windows and wanting to get away from big corporations.

It is comparatively to Debian/Ubuntu derivatives. Even Arch and NixOS probably have more users now. Lately I see some popularity of uBlue derivatives among new users, but I don't know how many people use it, and where the popularity comes from.

I wouldn't call switching kernels that hard. It takes a few clicks and a reboot to do. However, they kicker is that you need to know to do that. You don't know what you don't know.

I don't recommend PopOS! because I think the Gnome UI is confusing to people who have only used Windows before.

I think Gnome VS KDE it's just a POV

Your argument makes sense that KDE and Cinnamon can be welcoming to Windows users. However I can argue that it can also make these newcomers to keep a "windows-like" mindset and that can be frustrating.

If a newcomer comes to Gnome, due to it's totally different paradigm, it may induce this newcomer to have an open mind and, therefore, be more welcoming to linux experience.

I don't think one argument or the other is right or wrong. I think both arguments are valid and that's just a different perspective. I, personally, think that a totally new paradigm is good to newcomers, but be free to disagree, since you understand that there is no right or wrong regarding this topic

Nobara is a good choice, it's based on Fedora, and is maintained by Glorious Eggroll himself, it has out of the box features like proprietary driver installation, game mode, gamescope, etc. That's what I run on my gaming PC and my HTPC, where my work laptop runs Kubuntu.