I'm from the Y'all zone. Is it offensive to call trans people y'all?
I'm from the Y'all zone. Is it offensive to call trans people y'all?
If anyone can find more pixels for me i would appreciate it.
Thanks y'all.
I would have thought that “y’all” is even more so gender neutral and therefore less offensive/more accepted. It’s a contraction of “you all” right?
"y'all" fills a legitimately useful gap the English language has. Other languages have a word like this.
Edit: also something cool I just found out, some languages have a way to disinguish "we" (you and I), and "we" (me and the rest of us, not you). It's called clusivity and is missing from European languages. Many indigenous languages of the Americas and Oceania have this, as well as Vietnamese and northern dialects of Mandarin.
Not a gap in every dialect! "Ye" is another plural second person used in Ireland
Hear y'all hear y'all, Reggie King from o'er the holler brought pawpaw moonshine for the weddin'
And youse in Dublin.
Every dialect has a word for it. There's no gap.
The worst is when a language formally has a disambiguating word but then speakers all just decide to not use it.
Any examples of an equivalent in other languages?
I speak a small amount of French but can't think of one
"Vous" is the first one that comes to mind in french. But since it is also a more formal (and/or "respectful") version of "tu/toi", it can both designate a group of people or a single person, depending on the context (just like "you" in English). Sometimes people will use "vous tous" (literally "you all") to make this clear.
It is a little better than the "you" situation in English since if you are speaking with someone that is not using the singular form of "vous" to speak about you (which is basically anyone you are familiar with unless they are your boss or In-laws and kind of oldschool), it is instantly clear what they mean at least.
In Portuguese (especially Brazilian), there are singular and plural forms of "you": "você" (singular) and "vocês" (plural). In English, "you" behaves like a plural because it's followed by "are" instead of "is". The only exception I can see is "yourself" and "yourselves" that refer to both singular and plural forms.
However, In Portuguese, even though we have "vocês" as plural form, we also use "vocês todos" or "todos vocês" ("you all"/"all of you") sometimes.
Spanish has "Ustedes" (except in Spain, they use "Vosotros/Vosotras")
There is also “you lot”
I’m from Australia and I’ve started calling all groups of people yall because it’s gender neutral… very unaustralian term, and I love so much the irony of iconic southern terms being used to support trans activism
I'm German and I use y'all all the time when speaking English. it's funny, most of my English is from the internet so it's the most crazy mix of english
Why bother with importing y'all when we already have yous (or youse depending on how you want to spell it)? Or you could just treat 'you guys' as gender neutral, it effectively is these days with how people use it.
Do we have yous/youse? According to my understanding that's technically not a real word yet, it's slang.
I feel like y'all is the newer American version of 2nd person plural, while yous/youse/yinz are the non-American English counterparts.
I have always used you guys in a gender neutral manner historically, but people occasionally got offended by that. So I started using y'all several years ago and it's been going pretty good. Although I did initially spell it like ya'll until someone corrected me on reddit 😅
You forgot "Yinz"
People where I am from call everyone "you guys" - men, women, trans, doesn't matter, everyone is just "you guys" even when it's a woman addressing a group of women.
The literal meaning isn't gender neutral, but in actual practice, it 100% is.
As for "y'all" or "you all", I don't see how it could possibly be interpreted as offensive to any gender.
Dude is also situationally gender neutral. Saying "Hey dude" to a trans woman is misgendering her but exclaiming "Yo dude check this out!" or "Duuuude no way" is perfectly acceptable.
As for “y’all” or “you all”, I don’t see how it could possibly be interpreted as offensive to any gender.
I think "we don't take kindly to y'all" to a trans person would likely be offensive. Beyond that though, you're probably okay.
The literal meaning isn’t gender neutral, but in actual practice, it 100% is.
Unless you can ask a straight man how many guys he's slept with, it isn't gender neutral, no matter how resistant to this fact you are.
That's how people use it, whether you like it or not. I did not invent the language, but that's how people use it.
Saying "guys" on its own is also not the same thing as "you guys" in regions that do this.
You can shoot the messenger all you like but it is what it is and I have no power over how people in a region use a language, I am merely informing you of that fact.
Yall is the genderless southern hospitality greeting.
No bullshit no hate. Only yall
I've used y'all intentionally as a gender neutral term for years in the south.
Lately I've even seen "y'all means all" used as a pride slogan in the south.
Awesome! Thanks comrade.
I mean, neither "you" nor "all" is a gendered term in any way
as a trans person, I'm not offended by y'all in the slightest
This statement has strong Bilbo " I like less than half of you as well as you deserve" energy
(No hate, it just struck me as funny)
I lowkey always found that to be a southern type of insult, I could hear Steve Spurrier saying it
Y'all is the opposite of offensive for trans people. I lived in the south for a while, and I now use y'all specifically to be inclusive. I wouldn't say "you guys" is offensive to trans women, but I would say for me and likely other trans women it briefly brings to mind being misgendered in the past, so I would call it a small kindness to ube as gender neutral as possible.
Yup, I specifically use y'all and recommend it to people (like my parents) to replace gendered phrases, and I'm not from the y'all zone.
Still up for debate, "dude" and "hun/hon".
*I'm a trans woman also
I feel like I have watched in real time as Y'all has gained usage up in the Canadian Queer community.
I am old enough to still regard "hon" as demi hostile but "dude" seems to be drifting more and more gender neutral. At heart we may all just be ninja turtles all the way down
Thanks comrade
I thought y'all was just a gender neutral term combining you and all.
How would it be wrong or offensive to refer to refer to trans person as "y'all"? Genuine question.
How would it be wrong or offensive to refer to refer to trans person as "y'all"?
"Y'all not welcome in these parts"
You got me there.
I'm not from the south and use "y'all" all the time. Find it very useful for filling in a gap that English has and slightly faster than saying "you all". Its gender neutral in my opinion.
Never once thought of it as offensive.
Y'all is gender neutral,
doso I imagine it's fineEdit: typo lol
We're talking about Southern US pronunciation so much that I read your comment from "do I" onwards as if it was being spoken like a Southern Belle.
I'm from New Jersey and have never heard anyone unironically say "youse guys". Side note we also don't call it "Joisey".
I always thought youse guys was a new york city thing.
Youse guys wanna play stickball?
How you fuckers doing, eh?
I'm from "you guys" but I've lived in "y'all" and now I'm forever team "y'all," regardless of where I'm living.
It's the best export from the south, except maybe Texas brisket and pecan pie.
...y'all roughly correlates with coke, although there are some deep pockets of soda-water in the back country...
Y’all actually has gained particular traction in the north through the queer community. Most trans people I know use y’all even if their geographic location doesn’t indicate they should
Y'all reminds me of the bible belt. I'm not transgender but I am queer and now and then it makes me uncomfortable.
Guess I'll have to ask the person I'm addressing in the future.
Thanks comrade.
Yous in Scotland is great to wind up Proper English speakers. If they whinge they get a y'all
We are afraid to use common greetings now? How about we all refer to each other as "carbon units"?
The online rainbow police could get offended, you know.
Y'all = you all, which is gender neutral.
Also that map is missing the Chicagoland y'all exclave.
People who don't even live in the USA saying "y'all" is pure pain
I say "all of y'all" and make a point to really emphasize the "'".
You say "of?"
I thought it was basically all y'all
Or all'o'y'all
Why? I am not living in the us but it's a useful phrase.
Youse LOL, almost lost it when I heard it one time
All y'all never heard youse before?
Second person never has a gender in English. Saying "you" should also be fine, or "thee" if you feel like getting your quaker on.
Special requests notwithstanding - the platinum rule here is just to accommodate whatever you reasonably can.
I'll throw in "folks" as another gender neutral option. I say "you folks" all the time, especially in professional contexts. I'm not from the South, but I have family there so y'all is a part of my vocabulary. I use it in more informal situations pretty commonly.
We need a better second person plural in English. Y'all works but its a big language gap
Hey...
Folks
Friends
Comrades
Everyone
People
Pals
You motley crew
Weirdos
Siblings
Fuckers
..how you doing, wanna go to the movies?
(this is by no means exhaustive list, the point is there are plenty of existing and perfectly acceptable alternatives, pick one, or more, and get comfortable with it)
I've heard people say "yous" before.
I know. I hate it. I don't know why
Having exported myself from the deep South to Yankee land, "Y'all have a good one!" never fails to brighten the day of someone working a cash register.
In general, folks up here really like southern politeness. They think sugar wouldn't melt in my mouth. I get stopped in stores to talk all the time. Pretty frequently, they just give me a discount. I thought Yankees were supposed to be rude, but they're actually really nice in public.
Can "y'all" be singular, since there is "all y'all" for plural?
When talking about a group but only one individual of the group is present you can still use y'all.
No, you is the singular; y'all is the plural.
All y'all works because you might say "All of you all", I suppose.
Am I the only one who actually looked for more pixels for this guy?
Anywho, here you go my guy:
Edit: hmmm, Lemmy seems to be compressing it. Here's a link.
Trust me there are many more areas that say y'all
ITT: Yinzers
Fwiw, second person is fine as long as there's no misgendering... It's like calling someone by their name
As a non-english speaker, I appreciate «Y'all» 'cause it always bug me the absence of a way to reference more than one individual in English.
What you mean «You» is used to reference both one person and a crowd? English is fuck up.
Only if you man in it a "you people" kind of way - like y'all need to stay with your own kind- or something like that.
I bought a shirt once in Pittsburgh that says, “Yinz is a gender-neutral p pronoun”
There are pride buttons that say Y'all means all.
Maine I think loops back around to y’all territory…
As someone that grew up in y'all territory in Kansas, it's wildly easy to connect to people from Maine!
Is guys really needed after youse?
The guys is needed where there's no 2.pl pronoun to distinguish from individual you, but youse fixes that
I’m on the border of y’all and you guys
Your comment gives me the urge to create other maps you can comment on so that I can triangulate your position.
I am open to the opportunity
Is the difference between youse and youse guys the number of people involved? Similar to y'all and all y'all?
Nah you just replace you with youse. Example:
Happy birthday to youse, happy birthday to youse. Happy birthday this fucking guuuuy! Happy birthday to youse!
Where does this put Scott the Woz?
If you live on the line, or move north/west, it's now "you all".
I'm from Maryland and I said "howdy" in New York and I got roasted by the CVS clerk for 2 full minutes. And then I said "do y'all have Tylenol" in hopes that she could point me in the direction. Another minute of her roasting me...
Roast her back
It was too late. I was hung over as fuck anyways.
I have a VERY southern friend. He once said "y'all all".
Should be fine 👍
Where's my fellow "yo'd'll"s at
Your what now
Oh....you know 😏
It feels like a standard case of it's fine until it isn't. I wouldn't worry about it and only drop it from your vocabulary if you notice it causing harm.
Y'all left y'uns out of the map
What?
Out here in the you guys zone making yall happen. 10 years and you guys will be nearly gone cause people get tired of having to ubsubltly tack on "and gals" or "gals and nonbinary pals".
My boss says “you’ll”
I call everyone brah 🤙
I can't speak for anyone else, but you seem to be missing the biggest issue with this map: saying "you guys" excludes anyone but those identifying as male. You may not mean it that way, but I've had women be offended when I used that in the past, and I wouldn't like being referred to as a "gal" in a group of women. It's just not accurate.
Personally, for a gender-neutral way of addressing a group, I like "you folks".
English is not my native language. I felt kinda weird about using "you guys" until I heard a woman that used "you guys" to a 100% woman group. I stopped caring about that shit because natural languages are weird and it all doesn't matter. What matters is the intention of what you say, not its form. Y'all should stop caring about fixing other people's speech too.
