Biden already has those codes. If I look at where we started with Trump and where we ended up, and then where Biden picked up and where we ended up, my choice clearly becomes Biden. Trump went from "grab em by the pussy" to Covid to breaking a bunch of laws to an insurrection. Biden cleaned up Trump's mess and avoided a complete imminent global financial collapse. All things considered, I'd rather see Biden over Trump and it's too late to try to swap out Biden.
But have you considered that he didn't change military policy on Isreal?
That should be the one and only issue you base your vote on, according to a scary amount of people around here.
Edit: See? Here they are, saying Trump and Biden are the same. It's kinda wild to watch.
Different people have different priorities. I live in eastern EU. The idea of the US dropping all support for Ukraine is pretty damn scary to me. I obviously can't vote in the US election, but I will happily support Biden from across the pond due to that one issue.
To a Palestinian? Yeah, I understand they don't really care about anything outside the direct issues affecting their people so they'd be anti-Biden.
He didn't change policies on many other things too.
I'm not sure it makes sense to talk of them as of separate figures. The US state policy, internal and foreign, under both is eerily similar and continuous, with Trump it looked like "dumpster fire of the day", with Biden (and Obama before Trump) it looked like "another careful calculated decision", but they are all in the same general direction.
Biden cleaned up Trump’s mess and avoided a complete imminent global financial collapse.
Was it really Biden, though? Global economy is self-organizing and kinda reliable, like the Internet (by design, not by its real topology and those big underwater cables with no backup connecting whole continents).
no backup connecting whole continents
Wtf are you talking about, there are dozens of them, its literally a huge network of cables.
Theres a whole website about it
Also, global economy is highly fragile, it can take one major investment bubble like in 2008 or event like Covid in 2020 to shake its foundations. Countries all over the world have to pump shitloads of money into it to keep the economy in a state where it won‘t collapse.
Can we all agree that since we have an age-minimum of 35, then we should have an age-maximum tied to, say, retirement age?
The argument is simple: nobody is in their prime past retirement age. Nobody. And this by default suggests we guaranteed have better options to run the presidency than some geriatric seniors.
But then, how do have the oldest, whitest person in charge?
Don't worry, the 1% always wins while we live a capitalist way of life.
I see you have decided to criticize the democrats. I also see you have failed to post the required 100,000 word essay on how the Republicans are worse then the democrats.
That makes you a secret Russian Republican antisemetic nazi communist. Sorry... them the rules.
IDC how old they, I care how competent they are.
Theres plenty of incompetent middle aged and young people as well, letstry not to elect any of them, k?
Exactly this, I’d rather someone near me drive their car at 65mph, than drive next to someone who’s a cocaine addict going over 85mph on the freeway.
I think you're on to something. We can probably solve most of the problems Biden has in the public discourse by giving him some cocaine.
Correct, it's about competency. Age is not indicative of one's competency, just a mere suggestion - no matter if the person is young or old.
Well the good news is that if Biden wins all the names being tossed around for 28 are in their 40s or 50s at the oldest.
I'm crossing my fingers for Whitmer personally.
Bad news is that if Trump wins, they'll all probably be in prison by then.
Vote.
If you really believe the Republicans getting control of the nation state is a existential threat, you would want to use every tool possible to prevent that right?
What if we changed how we vote so maintaining democracy doesn't fall solely into the democrats lap? So the democrats have backup on the debate stage! So there are more people to call trump out on his bullshit. So we have more chances to stop the Republicans. Wouldn't you want more chances? Don't you want to do everything we can to stop the worst from occurring?
Consider working towards passing electoral reform in your state. Maine and Alaska were able to do it... why not yours?
Especially in a blue state. What is stopping blue states from passing electoral reform? Cause it ain't the Republicans...
What also sucks is that every other democrat running for president in 2028 is just a younger version of biden, complete with the same imperialist and segregationist politics.
As long as the two party system reigns supreme and one party puts forth absolutely insane candidates, the other candidate will be no more than a middle ground candidate that tries to siphon votes and take no meaningful stances.
It's a win win for conservatives, at worst they get someone that has to cater to some of their base.
Friendly reminder that only one of them is unstable enough to use them.
Don't care. I am voting against Project 2025 and for the guy that has an effective and good group around him...not the useful idiot that has to get a new group of people given to him by his handers because the last group is all in prison...
The same group that put him on the debate stage? The same group that allowed him to come off fully arrogant and out of touch in the latest interview? The same group that has essentially thrown one of the most important elections in the span of a week? Fuckin hell, there's a case to be made of elderly abuse against this 'good group'.
I'm gonna vote republican-light (D), but this head in the sand bullshit is an additional turn off. You should care.
I get it, the stakes are high and fascism looms, but shilling for the oligarchy is just barf. I'm surprised y'all haven't started wearing blue hats 'keep america great' or some stupid shit yet.
It isn't shilling it, it is recognizing that literally nothing can be done about it YET (especially between now and the election) and it is irrelevant for the topic of who to vote for this election...hell the only relevance is that trump will be the worst option for it, but it always comes up to pull voters away from the only good option, either as a no-vote or into a spoiler-vote.
#StopTheGerontocracy
#FuckThePalePaleoPatriarchy
Everybody is tired of these dinosaurs. I don't know anybody conservative or liberal who's thrilled about either candidate.
As far as this election goes, my thought process goes like this.
Biden: Oh my God, NO! He's terrible!
Trump: Oh my God, NO! He's terrible! x100
Therefore I'll be voting for Biden.
Is this more 'both sides the same' crappola? Sure sounds like that.
The sides are definitely not the same. One side is a fascist, a rapist, and a felon; the other side has trouble being coherent after 6pm.
They're not the same, and I know who I'm voting for (not the fascist). But damn do I wish we had some better choices.
I'm happy enough to vote for the Biden administration. Whether or not Biden is actually leading the charge himself doesn't really matter to me, it's what they have accomplished in the past 4 years that I actually like (with the obvious exception of Gaza).
To be clear, I'm not indifferent on the first 4 years of Biden, I actively like it and wish for it to continue if more aggressive reform isn't on the table, which it isn't, nor would I expect it to be.
That said, the debate validated the biggest concerns about Biden. I have faith that his administration would keep up the good work if Biden is too feeble to run the show himself. But it's shitty optics, and I don't blame people for being alarmed. Especially since Harris isn't very popular, nor do I fully trust her not to hold the reigns too tightly if they're passed to her.
I don't think this is. It's not wrong if it's true. In this case it's very true.
Now if you said both Biden and Trump committed the same amount of crimes. That would be doing the both sides thing.
Its both sides are shit
Biden is losing in the polls to trump. If he continues to run we will have Trump again. I'm scared shirtless. I wish the democratic party would quit gambling with our democracy and take the fascist threat seriously.
They are taking the threat seriously. The problem is who they consider the threat. Democrats don't see fascists as a threat to them, and do see progressives as a threat.
I’m scared shirtless.
This is clearly not The Good Place so you can say "shit."
To be fair, (spoilers for the show) it was the bad place where you couldn't swear
Shirt
Who is down voting this? Hilarious comment dude. You made me chuckle. Thanks.
Well, you're in the US, so it's not your problem if they decide to nuke someone outside it or, say, greenlight an invasion. While I have some of my family and myself in a place theoretically attractive to nukes, and half of my other family in a country likely to be invaded. Fortunately the rest is distributed between USA and a country which, despite all the cries, is in no significant danger.
You can be "sick of old men" all you like OP, but are you "sick of democracy, eager to embrace dictatorship?"
Doing away with First Past The Post voting in favor of a more representative electoral system (such as but not limited to Ranked Choice voting) will Introduce competition into the electoral process.
This will increase the quality of candidates across the political spectrum. Yes, this would even help the Republicans pick less insane candidates.
I highly recommend multiple seat districts so that multiple groups get representation. One seat districts are very 1800s. Regards from Northern Europe.
Cool, how do we do that before November?
We have to think further than the next election. At this point we just have to assume we will win this November and start planning for 2028. There's going to be a big strike that May Day so we would need to have sympathetic representatives wherever we can. As much as we hate biden for solely running on that, "not Republican" will get you far, maybe enough to flip even a local seat
Volunteer at an old folks’ home. Most old men just want to eat jello and play cards. They’re very sweet! Not power hungry lunatics like these two.
I wish all these two wanted was to eat jello and play cards.
This is a good idea for a game!
Can't you guys vote for individuals, to deflate the two factions a bit?
Not in our first past the post system. A third-party vote in the presidential election is effectively throwing away your vote. The time to vote for who you want instead of against who you don't is in local elections and primaries.
No. The individuals will work with other like-minded people across the government to accomplish their goals. The party affiliation helps you understand who they will plan to work with and what goals that group will be striving to accomplish. That is ultimately the most important thing to consider when voting: which group will be empowered to advance their goals.
Ugh that was bad.
If we don't get a 35 year old president at some point soon I'm gonna be upset.
Jon Ossoff for 2028
So am i and i am one
Can we get some young, hot men into office?
I'm Canadian, and while I am critical of Trudeau and Jagmeet Singh, I sure do enjoy LOOKING at them.
Shouldn't it be who's better at (nuclear) football?
Are we sure trump still doesn't possess the codes hidden away in a box somewhere?
Brooo
Both Sides, comrade?
Usually when I see someone bring up "both sides" it's a conservative like you trying to make people criticizing the democrats seem unreasonable.
Both sides are capitalist and conservative, but of course there are differences. Don't you want more differences?
If you really get people who often "both sides" you, do you wanna know how to shut them the fuck up? You put them in the game! You force them to put their words into action by passing electoral reform. Doing away with First Past The Post voting, getting rid of tge spoiler effect, and make third parties viable.
Make them prove it. Force them to show us how it's done. It's so easy right? Force them into the game and they won't have any "sides" to complain about.
More democracy is the answer, not hoping they vote for your guy.
Criticism of both capitalist parties from a leftist perspective doesn't imply a false equivalence.
Trumps face got pee'd on by a little girl, Biden banged a 12 year old when he was 30. Yeah. Interesting times in Hamburgerland
Didn't Biden literally just say "she was 12, I was 30" in relation to saying hi to someone in the crowd? Not saying that's normal, only acceptable answer here is he was chatting with a friend's child at some point, but also, where is the reference to him fucking her?
Bullshit, "good sir."
Trump was the #1 client on Epstein's list, correct me if I'm wrong.
I will add to this based off comments: I don't KNOW definitively Biden was a diddler. I don't. But the fucker authored the war on drugs crime bill. So he is a monster in his own ways, considering the degree of global suffering that has occurred because of the narcotics trade being outlawed instead of being treated like the health problem it is, e.g the Scandinavian policies on recreational drugs. It should all be taxed, manufactured by governments, and those funds going towards the public good, with addiction resources available to those that need it. People are addicts because they are trying to numb something, typically.
No one has said it in this thread, and there’s a lot of people talking about how they wish there was another option:
I’m voting for the Party for Socialism and Liberation and you can too!
They’re running Claudia de la Cruz on a platform of Palestinian statehood and an end to arms shipments to Israel.
There are many alternatives.
Pass electoral reform first IMO. Unless critical mass is achieved, we would be spoiling the election. This is why passing electoral reform is of utmost importance.
Democrats clearly understand the faults of First Past The Post voting. Go on any platform and suggest voting third party and the liberals will come in droves to explain the faults of the FPTP voting system.
Okay, you understand the voting system is flawed... then why do we still use FPTP voting? How can you explain these mathematical flaws to people considering voting third party and NOT do anything about the voting system? You don't get to have both.
I don’t buy that. Both major parties, all the donors, the media, the lobbying groups and all the party machines in all fifty states are heavily invested the system we have.
I’m not gonna wait till we tip the whole system over to record a vote that actually represents my political positions.
If the two major parties are afraid of third party spoilers then they can adopt the platforms of those third parties.
Even though I'll never vote for either of these genocidal neoliberal freaks, they are not the same. Saying one is bad because he is old is not an acceptable justification and it is ageism. The problem with Biden (regardless of his and his party's political orientation) is the fact that he is simply unsuitable for the job, he clearly doesn't have the mental and physical capacity for it. Trump on the other side (even though he's a fascist and regardless of the insane shit he says) is fine. He has the strength and mental clarity for the job. So don't compare Trump and Biden on this front, Trump can function just fine.
If we toss aside issues of ideology to focus just on technical ability to perform, I think you are missing a key factor. Electing a president is also electing the administration, and a president can only be as good as the people they surround themselves with. Biden knows how to assemble a solid team, while Trump doesn't. Trump is also incapable of listening to food advice, even in the rare instance where he allows it to be given to him.
Look at the issue of the newly expanded presidential immunity. The President is sheltered from prosecution for issuing an illegal order, but his staff is not required to follow that order. Which candidate will surround themselves with people who respect the law, and which candidate will surround themselves with lackeys?
I don't really think you can say for sure who has a better team and whatnot. That's an assumption and besides, Trump has proved that he knows exactly what he is doing with how consistently reactionary and neoliberal his term was. This pretty much shows that the decisions most of the time are not made by him, nor by any "team" he builds, but by the interests behind the conservative party. Likewise for Biden.
I don't want to sound like I'm defending Trump, I hate Trump and anything conservative/right wing with all my heart. I just want people to realize that when all that's left to talk about in public discourse is the mental capacity of the individual candidates and their criminal records, it is a sign of the narrowness of political differences of the parties, of absence of any important political point of confrontation. They have and historically had the same direction and interests with few differences on social issues that don't interfere with their interests. At some point people have to realize both parties are so similar and distant from any actual pressing problem in the world (genocide, climate change, billionaires) that the lesser evil doesn't hold up anymore - in every situation there is always a level of evilness that the lesser evil doesn't hold up when reached by both.
I am sick of genocidal lunatics (both of them) and their enablers (you).
My brother in Christ, I am Canadian.
*klanadian
