George Washington University encampment...
George Washington University encampment...
As "funny" as this might be, if you don't fucking vote Biden you're likely voting for a huge world wide change off a cliff. If Trump wins, then your precious Gaza will be wiped out or whatever similar words he used. And that is just the start. His claims, he wants to be a dictator, the 2025 document basically wishes the US to become Gilead, and lots more fun stuff.
Seriously, maybe this might be slightly panicky, but these are things that are in all seriousness claimed by the Republican party and Trump. That is what you will be voting for if you don't vote Biden , so how about you shut the . up for now about this, at least until after the elections?
On a side note, I can guarantee you that these groups end up receiving funding from Russia and whatnot. Not that they do that willingly or knowingly, but with Russia continuously meddling in US politics, you can rest assured that Putin won't sit by while this is happening, he needs his useful idiot in US power.
You know who could very quickly win those voters back and make sure he wins in a landslide? Joe Biden. And you know what is all that he has to do for it? Stop sending weapons and money to Israel. This is already what the US laws mandate by the way. So all he has to do is uphold US laws he is currently breaking
Bonus points for recognizing Palestine internationally and getting Israeli war criminals in front of the ICC.
Why are you blaming the victims of Bidens politics instead of Biden, who has all the power to change these things right now?
Bonus points for recognizing Palestine internationally and getting Israeli war criminals in front of the ICC.
That is laughable. A US president to get war criminals before a court that the US does not recognize.
You know who could lose the elections if he pushes against the Israeli government causing disenfranchised Jewish voters?
Yeah. It's not that easy.
This lime of thinking is all well and good. We should be holding Biden accountable for what tragedies we endorse on the world stage.
But the answer is not enabling a much worse monster to take his place. Especially considering the monster in question has a unilaterally worse stance on almost everything we are currently upset with Biden about.
It's not as black and white as justification of not voting because "Biden could win you/them back". We are on a sinking ship, and even though Biden could be doing more to patch it up, Trump is actively advocating for a bigger hole.
if you don't fucking vote Biden
your precious Gaza
so how about you shut the . up for now about this, at least until after the elections?
I can guarantee you that these groups end up receiving funding from Russia and whatnot
You can fuck ALL the way off with that bullshit. Libs like this are going to guarantee low turnout if they keep callously screaming shit like this to people who feel strongly about not being party to butchering children.
Instead of threatening and blaming voters you should be threatening and blaming the administration for alienating and disenfranchising millions of voters who would otherwise vote for him.
Yeah, and all of it is pretty on point, like it or not.
Go vote trump, or that brain worm guy, or don't vote at all. Trump will then win and when he's been in for a year, let's talk again and see how well your argument held up.
I'd love to do anything else than what I'm doing now but stakes are rather high, not only for Palestinians, not only for Americans.
people who feel strongly about not being party to butchering children
You think Trump taking the white house is going to change that? The only difference enabling republicans is going to make is how much things are going to get worse.
Conservative voters aren't bound by the same morals. They don't abstain because their leaders are causing suffering.
Only an idiot would abstain or vote for Trump all because of this issue. Biden is a shit president, but he's worlds better than Trump has been, or could ever be.
This said, I agree that OP can fuck off with some of that language. The protests need to call Biden out. Bonus points for calling both candidates out, though. They've both chosen the wrong side of this.
Criticism of Biden is not endorsement of trump. The people protesting are likely progressives who hate trump.
Criticize him all you want, but please wait until the election is over? Pretty please? Last thing we need is people lashing out and not voting at all, that's how you get another 4 years of trump
Damn and here I was letting genocide distract me from the election cycle. Boy is my face red.
I agree that everyone should vote Biden in November, but no... this can't wait until then. Biden needs to address this, and he's absolutely earning the nickname we see here by failing to do so.
He didn't start this mess, and we probably can't abandon Israel as an ally for a myriad of tactical and political reasons... But we can and should address the weapons being sent over regularly.
I agree it can't wait, but it will have to. You forget that Biden amhas more things to take into account than just our opinions on it, right as we may be. If he kicks the Israeli government he might disenfranchise the Jewish community who then may decide not to vote for him, then Trump it is and bye bye Palestinians. It must suck to be in his place.
Anyway, I would not immediately assume that Biden is loving this genocide, he likely has many things to consider
Blue Maga : even more deranged that the original with a twist.
your precious Gaza
Disgusting
The United States is funding and arming a genocide against the Gazans. And you diminish this abomination.
We Americans deserve what we get
Did you miss the entire point there?
Seriously, THAT is the part you picked up? Read, you fool...
We Americans deserve what we get
Disgusting
Russia is funding and arming a fascist movement against the Americans. And you diminish this abimination. /s
Man, it's so easy to make someone sound bad when you purposefully misrepresent what they said. You didn't actually engage with them. You only tried to make them sound evil, even though they're advocating for protecting Palestinians as much as we possibly can. Please stop this garbage.
When the world catches fire we will douse it with gasoline hoping it puts it out
What about Atrocity Trump? They point at Biden, but never the disaster trump would ensure.
Biden is the one supporting slaughter right now, and Biden is the one with power to stop it.
What would protesting Trump do?
Trump tells Israel to "finish the job" in gaza,
https://apnews.com/article/trump-israel-gaza-netanyahu-biden-ba17bedaf2f1b5f2ea220828d0fba73b
You should try knowing what you're talking about some time
Honestly? It would keep him hopefully from having a close enough election to contest it, game it, and potentially evade punishment for the crimes he's actually on trial RIGHT NOW for committing. Then there is precedent for punishing a president and guess who can be next?
Biden does not sit on a button that says "lower gas prices" or "defund Israel" or "hold trump accountable" or any of a whole variety of things in the first place. Can he do more? Sure. Would I trash him because everybody has to do the exact right thing with the exact right issue every time or I'm going to take my ball and go home to let the other guy win and escape punishment for the first time ever? Fuck. No.
Get precedent for punishment, then punish them all.
You know who's currently president and is currently sending weapons to Israel right?
I'm so glad Trump is running because it means Biden can do literally anything and every single voter can just scream BUT TRUMP TOO and suddenly Joe is absolved.
How is that relevant to this? Are people not allowed to protest now because "other guy would be worse"? That's an actual authoritarian tactic.
This isn't saying "Trump would be better". This is saying "Biden supporting a genocide is unacceptable".
Woaah. Hold up there cowboy. Are you suggesting we hold politicians responsible for their policy?
Yeah, we should all pretend everything's fine so that after the election happens we can keep sending bombs to do genocide.
"You should vote for a person enabling genocide because the other candidate hypothetically would have done worse in an alternate reality, maybe." Real high iq take there.
Yeah, because what I imagine will happen is far more important than what is happening!
Young people think this election is theirs to lose.
Say hello to your ronald regan moment. Say hello to your nixon moment. Say hello to your george bush moment. Say hello to your trump moment.
That's what will haunt you until you die in a shittier world than what you started in.
And when you wonder why progress is never possible you can think back to it.
Progress isn't possible in the US because Dems kept getting away with not being as bad as Reps instead of actually having to be better. As the result the Dems are getting worse and worse and worse and the Reps are getting even more insane. Biden is still running internment camps at the borders. Biden is still building Trumps wall. Biden is still running Guantanamo.
All you get by voting the "lesser" of two evils is double the evil next time.
But when the Dems actually risk losing over their shit, they will be inclined to change it. And if they don't change it, that means that they rather want to Trump to win the election than they want to end a fucking genocide. You are gaslighting yourself instead of holding the responsible people accountable.
Progress isn't possible because people who want progress refuse to unite under a concerted effort to make it happen. Biden was able to enact a lot of progressive policies. Hes not perfect, no one is, but you can see the progressive wing of the party have a seat at the table in the Biden government.
Despite all that there are some progressives who want to sabotage everything they worked for.
And who the fuck cares what the neolibs want. They are another obstacle that need to be done away with.
Dude you're so right, let's vote trump in and show the world what we really think!
Blue Maga
scum(a pleonasm) even more hawkish that the like of Nixon to say the least...
ITT: Shills for the DNC that forgot what first amendment rights mean
Wouldn't they just be expressing their... nm
They need to outlaw illumination
Yes, I'm done with all those near-identical motion flicks
These kids are gonna feel none of the blowback when trump wins and when actual palestinians ask them why they let the Genocide come here they'll give some karen shit about how it's the party's job to convince them to vote against fascism happening here.
Yeah
"Genocide Joe" seems like the perfect republican plot to make people abstain from voting because the deliberately leave out how Trump would make matters 100 times worse.
Biden is constantly challenging Netanyahu while Trump would deliberately hand them a full and permanent occupation of Palestine on a silver plate.
People already forgot that it was trump who moved the embassy to Jerusalem basically destroying the USAs support for a two state solution?
Yes it's actually quite despicable. Anyone using the brain dead slogan of genocide Joe is literally downplaying genocide. This isn't a defense of biden. Biden is making his own problems here. What he is doing is enabling. Not committing genocide. Even then he actually has been pushing diplomatically for it to stop. I get it though. Enabling Biden or enabling Joe doesn't really have the propaganda punch. Not like Bibi The Butcher of Bethlehem.
People don't want diplomacy. They want what they want. And they don't care or understand how they could get it. It's easy to make demands. Anyone can do it. Getting things done is a lot harder. This isn't too attack anyone putting pressure on Biden to put pressure on Netanyahu. Just the irresponsible ones making it genocide belittling propaganda slogans.
Oh, you bet. Republicans are getting a big fat chub over this topic. This war in Gaza is the best thing that could have ever happened to them in the year long run up to the election. Wouldn't doubt that China and Russia are also responsible for spreading the message to sow discord and doubt. For every person they successfully convince to stay home on election day, that shortens that gap between Trump and Biden by one less vote in Trump's favor, not to mention the even more important down ballot races.
Forget trying to explain this to people on Lemmy, though. They're not interested in listening.
Ewww.... Sanity.
Cant wait for 20 bad faith actors to drop in and downvote the shit out of u the second this post/comment starts picking up steam.
E: here they are! This post kicked off with 6 or 7 comments all echoing this sort of sanity, but here come the downvote brigade making it look like truth is less popular than fiction. Per the usual, calling it out angers the vlad supporters greatly. Of course its the usual suspects, too, come to defend their paid comrades efforts to fuck up our elections.
As someone pointed out before, its all goebbels style repetition of the same continually disproven points, but hearing it enough plants the seed in enough minds to where it starts to sound like truth.
Yeah, we should let Joe do genocide because if we don't, Trump will do genocide 😢
Pathetic.
Joe Biden isn't doing a genocide.
You realize plenty of very smart people do not agree that there is a genocide happening in Gaza?
It's a warzone in a place with a culture of encouragement for willingly standing under incoming bombs to try and prove a point.
The low five-figure civilian death toll is not a product of Israel's legitimate self-defense (targeting the 450 miles of tunnels that zigzag an area only 25 miles wide). It is a direct product of Hamas and the culture that it fosters in Gaza.
How sad are these morons going to be when Trump gets in and starts off a war that kills millions of people? Trump already tried once and the only reason we avoided it was because of the international backlash against Iran after it tried to shoot down a US bomber but accidentally shot down its own civilian airliner.
"Genocide Joe" is a foreign propoganda meme. People saying it have been tricked.
Dude actual Palestinians are not going to give a crap for Trump's 'genocide' in the US. They have a real genocide inflicted upon them to deal with.
Whataboutism.
"Um, aktually sweatie, if the Palestinians didn't want US jets running sorties on the West Bank, they should have convinced the DEMONRATS to run a better candidate"
Don't worry - just as "BIDEN HATES UNIONS" was the drumbeat before October 7, so too would they find some other excuse to make life worse for the oppressed if Biden cut off all aid to Israel tomorrow.
To all of you worried that Biden's support of genocide (or whatever words you use to pussyfoot around the issue) will cause Trump to win the upcoming election, I would like to remind you most of these students are most likely not on Lemmy. If Biden wants to win an election, he has to do things that will get people to vote for him; not simply cry Trump exists. I'm so sick of this fearmongering tactic; the man is literally trying to turn off their preferred form of information while stomping on their other first amendment rights as well.
Is it asking much for you to actually be a candidate worth voting for when your biggest opponent is Trump? So much skirting around the question
blah blah blah, what about
her emailsthe other guy. - Biden supportersUninformed teenagers are no different than uninformed adults.
Trump tells Israel to "finish the job" in gaza, while Russian operatives and provocateurs try to convince kids that Biden is the worse choice
https://apnews.com/article/trump-israel-gaza-netanyahu-biden-ba17bedaf2f1b5f2ea220828d0fba73b
He says many things. Trump also ended a few wars in the region as well. Trump has a better record in the Middle east then the last two Democratic presidents (one big bomb versus 100,000s of deaths). Bringing up the Middle East for the US presidential election is a negative point for Democrats (unless you want to go back to Bush who left office decades ago).
Trump is still out of jail because this current government is that incompetent.
Exactly. Simply existing as the lesser of two evils isn't enough anymore. You actually have to do things to get votes.
Or is that what he's doing? He's just not trying to get the youth vote and is trying to pull conservative boomers by shitting on Gen Z and "owning the youth"? "See I can piss off the left just like Orange Jesus!"
Especially when both of them have already won that office (and neither deserve to be reelected).
Hell yeah, fuck that guy.
Many are saying this
Another day with a similar post about how Biden is single handedly murdering children in Gaza.
It has to be bots… right? Or bad faith actors.
Could Biden do more to reduce the suffering in this war, probably. But no one here is point ling out specific executive powers he should be exercising or diplomacy that’s being left on the table. Instead it’s all personal attacks that appear primarily motived to discourage likely democratic voters by drawing lines between their votes and enabling genocide. As if it’s somehow that simple.
Damn that sucks.
He should stop murdering children in Gaza, that would help a lot.
Yeah, when their "logic" leads up to "let's elect Trump instead" it's pretty damn sad
Why are you lying? The logic is quite simple: If the Dems uphold the US laws of not sending weapons to war criminals and genociders, if the Dems protect constitutional rights like free speach and if the Dems abide by international law and order, then they will be voted.
You are like an abused spouse making excuses for your abuser instead of demanding him to abide by the rules.
There is another way
No, no, and F NO!
You vote that and you can pretty much be sure that Trump wins.
Yes, it sucks, but vote Biden, like him or not. You can't risk trump getting into a position of power...
and as I write this, why am I even trying? These university students are vapid and dumb enough to do this anyway, not vote or vote some alternative , thinking they are making the world better while they are actively destroying it. Sorry, but yes, people are unknowingly but willingly destroying their own and our futures.
If doing nothing is enough for collapse, then we've already effectively collapsed.
These university students are vapid and dumb enough to do this anyway, not vote or vote some alternative , thinking they are making the world better while they are actively destroying it.
This mentality right here is exactly why you're headed to a devastating runback of 2016. No seeing the other point of view or wondering why people would feel a certain way, just denigration and dismissal.
You better get to knocking on doors, you only got 6 months to go!
So, people just broadly don't understand the concept of a protest vote, huh? If people don't even understand that, then oy vey, we're fuckin cooked lads I dunno what to tell yous, the democracy is already dead. Even beyond just first past the post voting, and all the shit that everyone knows is cooked but also knows will never get fixed. To the point that people can't even like, understand strategic voting or the contexts in which it might happen. Just a flat incurious blanket creed screamed at opposition with no consideration for applications or the intricacies of how our democracies work.
Like I dunno, we're cooked. Even if biden stopped being a shitheel and funding israel, or full tilted in the other direction and at least tried to apply the brakes instead of going above and beyond to accelerate it, he has to realize that all faith in his institution would be like, totally shot, right? Like, that everyone would just expect him to restart it again immediately after the election, with four extra years of basically no accountability for israel to "mow the lawn"? Or I guess in this place, rip out the lawn and replace it with more parking or whatever. Like, the strategy here has to be one of appealing to a kind of core bloodthirsty liberal base that will support the genocide even across bipartisan lines, because that's what his actions would say. But then, that doesn't make any sense at all, because his admin keeps leaking shit about how he's so broken up over the fact that this is happening and oh no bros he wishes he could do more and his little heart just can't take it.
I dunno. We're so cooked from every angle. If Biden was going to stop, now would be the moment at which he would. It's right before an election, there's mass protests that are getting headlined. Maybe the pressure and violence of those protest might increase, but we're just about getting to the point where the news cycle has probably chewed them up, and we're also getting to the point, as far as I've seen, where gaza is so bombed out that images of it aren't making it out as much as they used to, on top of the media already having worked it's way through that. If Biden was gonna drop it, it's around this point. If he still hasn't and we've reached like actual election season, right, then there's not really any amount of pressure that would've caused him to drop it, he would've clearly signaled by that point that israel killing people is more important to him than winning the presidency, or keeping trump from winning. If he was more interested in the latter then he probably would've already ceded the race to someone else more broadly appealing and primed to go for it that isn't fucking 81 years old, to be honest.
Cooked, our cockles are cooked. We've never not been cooked, we'll never not be cooked.
we're giga cooked, tbqh. No country on the planet has ever been more cooked.
No matter who wins, I would like to pre-emptively congratulate Ronald Reagan on his 12th straight term as president of this great nation.
Absolute dumbass students getting tricked by foreign propoganda.
Joe Biden is not president of Israel. ✅
Isreal has all the bombs it needs to annihilate Gaza and the West Bank without any US aid. ✅
And the American congress has done nothing to stop the flow of weapons to Israel. There is no one in charge trying to stop the genocide
The global politics of the situation won't allow any significant reduction as Iran and others will take it as an invitation to increase their aggression which is viewed as a worse long term outcome for the region by the state department. Short of revolution in Iran I don't see their calculation on that changing anytime soon.
It would be a derilection of office for Congress to voluntarily weaken Israel. It has nothing to do with Gaza. Our alliance is about Iran. Our alliance keeps peace and stability that protects tens of millions of lives. Imagine how sads you'd be from an Iran Israel war in which 30,000 people are dying every day, or much, much worse.
Bankrolling a genocide is the next worst thing you can do after actually executing one.
Look, as someone stuck with a corporate, colonialist, party, and a straight fascist/theocratic party, I feel fucked. However, everything I am mad bad will only be worse not voting for Joe. The DNC has spent decades., and untold amounts of money, supporting more, and more, radical republican candidates so that they can hold us in this exact position. The only way I see out of this is from the ground up. Last year I joined a local political group that works to inform people on a variety of ways to break the two party system. It's the last play before the diplomatic impasse is so adamant that nothing short of violence will change anything. I found it surprisingly easy to find organizations working for a variety of voting reforms I can get behind in my state simply by searching "voting reform advocacy groups in (my state)".
Probably 10 times over too. Just agreeing that Israel needs zero help on what they are doing in Gaza.
You went from 3 points to -8 in like 3 hrs. But nope! No manipulation of votes going on here!!
Pretty sure u had more when i first found this thread too, back when the few comments it had were all sane.
Pretty wild. I saw it at 8 at one point, and was surprised.
I get it. People are super sad about all this death. I'm sad about it, too. But it doesn't blind me to much more important matters. Sucks that 30,000 people is less important than containing Iran; that is entirely the fault of Iran and Hamas, though. Those bodies are on Hamas.
Glad you showed up to lie and shill for israel and Biden
I think if you are privileged enough to grow up in America, and you hate America, there is something wrong with you. Yeah Unger people these days don't just criticize America... They actively hate it without recognizing the privilege they have. It seems to be a failure of education and their own sense of worth. We live in one of the most free nations in the world. One of the safest. One that gives the most opportunity. But they get caught up in echo chambers that promote failed economic systems. It's really frustrating to observe.
We live in one of the most free nations in the world
Students are catching facefuls of mace and rubber bullets for protesting, right now, btw. That activity protected by the 1st amendment. But freedom or whatever, yeah. We have so many freedoms, just don't try to use them, or we'll send the armor-clad thugs after you!
be america
destabilize other nations
overthrow democratically elected peoples
invade other countries
cause death, destruction, and chaos
more recently support a genocide
pickachu surprised face when people hate me
pickachu surprised face when my own populace learns about the atrocities I committed and is disgusted by it
Yes, we Americans are privileged, but whats wrong with being critical of our role and trying to change it? In the case of these students they are trying to do just that.
Quite the claims you've made: "Freedom" is difficult to quantify, but I would argue that as an individual we do typically have a decent standard of liberties. As long as you're white, male and haven't ever committed any sort of crime.
"One of the safest", according to multiple safety ranking organizations, the US is on the higher half of crime rate (per capita) and typically ranks in the bottom half (89) in safety ratings. https://www.numbeo.com/crime/rankings_by_country.jsp
"Gives the most opportunity" I think this depends largely on what you consider opportunity. If we look at poverty rates, the US is also not near the top with about an 18% poverty rate. I would consider anything more than 0% to be a place that does not provide the most opportunity. Sure, not everyone is willing to do what they need to get out of poverty, but certainly very few in that group are voluntarily there. https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/poverty-rate-by-country
I do agree that Lemmy is very much an echo chamber of "capitalism bad", but the US is also quite extreme in terms of wage and wealth disparity. It's hard to believe your country is great when 10% of the population holds nearly 67% of the nation's wealth, and the bottom 50% holds only 2.5% of it. That's extremely polarized. https://www.stlouisfed.org/institute-for-economic-equity/the-state-of-us-wealth-inequality
I think if you are privileged enough to grow up in America, and you hate America, there is something wrong with you.
Do you have any more quotes from people complaining about the civil rights movement?