Magneto is the manifestation of the saying, "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter." You could probably reasonably say:
Professor X : Magneto :: Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. : Malcom X
Professor X and the X-Men were all for mutant equality, but they always favored peaceful acceptance. Conversely, Magneto recognized that large portions of society would never accept mutants. It also bears mentioning that Magneto carried some "racist" (for lack of a better word) tendencies towards non-mutants. In his view, non-mutants are lesser beings.
It's kind of hard to argue that non-mutants aren't lesser beings when mutants literally have powers that no normal human could ever hope to have, powers that can even defy the basic laws of physics.
While I see your point, and I'm not at all painting you with this brush, I think that reasoning could also be used to argue that, e.g., autistic people are lesser beings. I know it's a different universe, but look at Superman: Unquestionably a superior being, but like Professor X, he never put himself on that pedestal. Magneto's insistence that non-mutants are and maybe should be subservient pretty much requires conflict, and starts folks down a path towards subjugation, enslavement, and ultimately elimination. Note: not extinction. Elimination requires action, while extinction, allowing for mitigating circumstances, does not.
Add to all of this that it's pretty easy to understand, and even relate to the origins of how Magnet and Professor X see non-mutants, and X-Men is a pretty great story/universe. They're both similarly flawed, but in very different ways.
Do you consider people with learning disabilities lesser than human? I think that is the point they are trying to make. Just because they did not evolve does not mean they are better. Better athletes and performers are revered because they do things normal people cannot, but it doesn't make them more human.
The X-men type mutants had powers that seemed to defy the known laws of physics. But, they showed pretty often that most mutants had more drawbacks than benefits.
What made Magneto a villain was that he decided that mutants were the next evolutionary step, and that humans were therefore obsolete. It wasn't even like predicting that mutants were superior and that as a result eventually humans would fade away. It was that he decided that one "race" was superior and therefore was justified in ruling over the inferior race. Which, you know, is pretty dark for a holocaust survivor.
I mean they did have the Morlocks so it wasn't like every mutation was a cool superhero ability
I love MLK but if I had been around in the days of civil rights, I would definitely have been a Malcom x guy
Good news, you're still in the days of civil rights.
I think poison Ivy is the best example of the “yeah I can’t pretend this is the villain anymore”
Fuck Batman
Mt.freeze just wanted to save his wife but the bills made him turn to crime.
See also: Harley Quinn & Poison Ivy respectively.
Ivy sure, given what's happening with our climate I would agree.
Harley is just a straight psycho.
Depends on what version of Harley you're talking about. The original one from Batman: the Animated Series showed that she actually did have morals, she was just totally in the sway of the Joker. Batman was able to convince her to help him more than once by appealing to her good side.
Harley in the self-titled Harley Quinn cartoon definitely has a good side, but she's also a psycho. It's complicated. Unlike her love for Ivy.
Other versions, they definitely lean in on the "Joker except a woman" angle.
Magneto was meant to be a stand in for Malcom X...
Malcom X's only crime was that white people were afraid of him. Meaning he did nothing wrong.
So Magneto can't be a villain unless you have him gripping the villain ball pretty hard.
The problem with Magento as a character is that he's portrayed as Malcolm X in his rhetoric, but as Dr. Strangelove in his technique. The number of times Magneto has tried to engage in Uno-Reverse Genocide - reprogramming Sentinels, reverse engineering killer viruses, rebounding mind control, redirecting asteroids and bombs aimed at his friends back towards civilian non-mutant areas, reversing the magic ray that strips you of your mutant abilities so that it gives them to you instead - makes him deeply unsympathetic simply because this shit never actually works and typically turns him the poster child for "Why All Mutants Must Be Exterminated!" rhetoric works on the non-mutant population.
Say what you will about Malcolm X, but he never tried to brainwash the LAPD into killing all the white people.
Say what you will about Malcolm X, but he never tried to brainwash the LAPD into killing all the white people.
That was Malcolm's first mistake, his second was dying.
Fair enough
I get the sentiment. But literally every single creator has come out and said he wasn't based on Malcolm X.
Magneto was meant to be a stand in for Malcom X...
While the X-Men were an allegory of the civil rights movement from the get go, I'm quite certain at the time Magneto was just intended as a villain.
I mean... his terrorist group was called “The Brotherhood of Evil Mutants”, and some of the members were definitely of the moustache twirling puppy kicking kind, including Magneto himself, at first...
Can someone help me out with this? Not a super hero guy. Why is magneto good now?
So magneto has actually fought for mutant rights from the beginning. And every time he gets ahead the xmen win and mutant rights don't really move forward. The xmen literally fight for the status quo. The status quo is bad for mutants, but they want to keep it for some reason. An analogy I've heard a lot is that professor x is the mlk to Magneto's Malcolm x. The difference is that mlk didn't bank roll a CIA black ops style team to constantly beat up Malcolm x whenever he started getting a leg up.
People are fed up. They're more open to extreme actions. That's why people are more sympathetic to Magneto
The xmen literally fight for the status quo. The status quo is bad for mutants, but they want to keep it for some reason.
Not quite. Professor X believes that humans will eventually overcome their inherit racism and would be able to live with mutants in peace. He also believes any act of violence from the mutants will push this ideal future further and further (he also does not agree on hurting humans indiscriminately because not all humans are rabid racists)
Whether Professor X is enlightened or just naive, well that's another story
IMO a better comparison would be Professor X is the same as the core democratic party and Magneto is the progressive wing.
"Fought for mutant rights" is a stretch. At the start he was a 2-dimensional villain fighting for mutants to rule over humans.
Direct quote: "The moment is at hand! All my months of preparation and planning shall pay off! The Human Race no longer deserves dominion over the planet Earth! The Day of the Mutants is upon us! The first phase of my plan shall be to show my power... to make homo sapiens bow to homo superior!" His plan involves invading a military base and taking control of "The mightiest rocket of all".
As for the status quo, the emergence of mutants changed the status quo. What Xavier is generally fighting for is that mutants have the same rights as normal humans. Magneto is fighting for mutants to dominate over humans. And, certain powerful interest in the government are fighting to either cage or exterminate mutants. The early years of the X-men comics are fights on one side against Magneto trying to do something with his group of super-powered mutants (literally called the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants), and on the other side fighting against powerful forces in the (human) government who see mutants as a threat and want to stop them before they get too powerful. Plus a bunch of fights against aliens, dimensional-hopping baddies, dinosaur-human hybrids from Antarctica, you know, the usual.
Eventually, Magneto is seemingly satisfied with mutants having their own country where they get to set their own laws and live separately from humans (backed up by the threat of force from the most powerful mutants), whereas Xavier wants humanity and mutants to live together in peace and harmony.
All it takes is one mutant to fuck up the trust built with humans. Professor X is on ketamine
Put simply, given the state and direction of the world the lofty, idealistic goals of Professor Xavier of peaceful coexistence and mutual trust have come to seem quaint and naive in a world of division, exploitation, inequality, discrimination, and hate. Magneto, by contrast, has always advocated the use of force and exercise of power, not in the interest of "bwahaha, I'm a bad guy!" evil, but in the interest of enacting vigilante justice and/or almost anarchic self-determination outside the system when the system fails.
So in 2024, your sympathy towards Magneto is inversely tied to your faith in the system to deliver fair and just outcomes. The more your faith in that has slipped, the closer you get to the position that Magneto is right.
Depending on the story magneto ranges from Hitler 2.0 to anti-hero. The better stories tend to be him as an anti-hero. It generally boils down to Xavier believing people are good and they will chose the right option if you set a good example. Magneto believes people are bastards and you have to force them into the right decision.
Magneto's whole shtick is that he survived the holocaust. This made him a radical against discrimination. So when he sees the mutant minority starting to get the same treatment as Jews in Germany (dehumanizing propaganda, lists and "yellow stars") he's like "not this time" and decides to start fighting before things get concentration camp bad.
Professor X believes that regular humans and mutants can reach an understanding despite all the propaganda to the contrary. But if mutants on one side (magneto)attack then due to the powers only other mutants are really effective, both for stopping them and for showing that it's "not all mutants".
This is a fantastic explanation. Thank you!
He just wanted freedom from subjugation for the mutants. Having survived the Holocaust, he had strong feelings about the government deciding they weren't people with equal protections.
He was akin to the Malcolm X to Charles's King.
I’m not super into comics so someone let me know if I’m off base here but…
Ok so the X men are stand ins for marginalized people. Their primary conflict is that they are demonized by society, even though they are a boon for society. Charles and Magneto attempt to solve this in different ways. Charles via working within the system, and appealing to saving their haters to prove they are good and restraining what makes them different. And Magneto is heavily militant in his defense of mutants against any who would harm them, and is big in not hiding who you are.
Now Magneto is villain coded so don’t take what the post said without a grain of salt. He does bad things. But these days he usually is given a sympathetic reason. And due to how comics and stories are told Charles Xavier will never succeed in his quest to prove mutants are not to be feared. (Especially when you have some kids who’s power is they turn into a literal nuclear bomb that will go off at any time for any reason… poor kid)
But this ties in with the rise in right wing authoritarian hate mobs
If anyone wants to read the comic referred to: https://imgur.artemislena.eu/gallery/I71V6
Based off of what you’ve said I’ll take Magneto on my side! Covid showed us reasoning doesn’t work lol
I'll take a shot but I'm not a die hard X-Men guy. If someone has a little more precision please correct me.
Basically magnetos driving idea is that people (and their governments) are out to get mutants and won't ever change, so it's up to him to lead mutants to fight back. Basically if they want respect and fair treatment, they have to take it for themselves. He tries many times in many ways to pull down the establishment by, for example, attempting to convert all people to mutants.
The premise of the post is basically that, since Reagan, social support is diminishing and power and wealth are concentrating in such a way in the upper class. Ergo, taking an... uh... active approach in advocating for ourselves is looking increasingly like a good idea.
In my opinion,
Magneto being a victim / survivor of Anti-Semitism , has made him have
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a severe black-and-white justice complex.
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a severe inferiority complex.
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a do-or-die / either friend-or-foe complex.
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a guilt for being powerless to save himself or his parents.
All these things are a complex brew in the psyche of any human being.
It made Prof.X seem somewhat naive or Magneto too brash/risky.
The balance of things either Prof.X or Magneto depending on the scenario plays out. Neither of the results or methods are satisfactory or acceptable but it is a quandary.
No one can predict at the moment of action/in-action where is the correct path.
That is what it means to live your life. Regrets or no-regrets no one can say but you.
Your lived-experience IS NOT a solution for the entire planet or universe. DO NOT apply your solution on others.
Let them live their life.
And that is sometimes very very hard to let-go or adopt.
This is my opinion. You may or may not agree with me. Im good.
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You're getting a lot of answers that are more sympathetic to Magneto than he deserves.
I'd argue that Magneto has a slightly better argument on diagnosing the problem (that humans and mutants can't peacefully coexist) than Professor X (that humans and mutants must find a way to peacefully coexist).
But the logical diagnosis of "the humans will genocide the mutants of we let them" doesn't make Magneto the good guy when he prescribes a solution for that problem. The history of the character oscillates between trying to create segregated societies where mutants are separate and not accountable to the human world, or outright subjugation or genocide of the humans.
Maybe peaceful coexistence isn't possible. But is it better to continually strive for that ideal, or is it better to reject humanity entirely and create strict segregation (or destruction) of the other side?
Because most superhero writers are assholes who never think of the bigger implications of the world they write.
Magneto is basically a racist. He thinks non-mutants are inferior and should be exterminated. How is he fucking right?
No he does not, especially if you're going with 90s Magneto. It's the whole reason Fabian Cortez tried to murder him.
He is however a zionist and wants mutants to have their own homeland separate from baseline humans.
He is however a zionist and wants mutants to have their own homeland separate from baseline humans.
Magneto is more akin to Nelson Mandela than Ben Gurion, at least with respect to Genosha. He came in as a kind of terrorist-liberator and, after a revolutionary insurrection overthrew the apartheid regime, established it as a BRICS style unaligned state.
But then, because Western Writing, he launched a Hitler-esque plan for world conquest that got the mutant population eradicated as a result. The island has been repeatedly rebooted as this ostensibly safe haven for mutants, but typically becomes a giant death trap where the population is wiped out over and over again.
The moral of Magneto tends to be "Stop being radical, you're just going to get everyone killed". Strangely enough, this never seems to apply to the various secret societies and state agencies running around with the giant killer robots that are primarily responsible for these genocides.
I get the sense that Magneto inherited good-guy status just because using him as a rhetorical and physical punching bag has worn thin after 60 years.
especially if you're going with 90s Magneto
Nearly all my X-Men knowledge comes from the 90's animated series and a few of the comics. He literally tries to wipe out humans and/or make everyone a mutant at least twice. He even acknowledges this in the new X-Men 97 series as he tries to atone for it and live up to Xavier's expectations.
Because humanity is a plague
Yes but from the very beginning, Eddie Brock's Venom would protect who they (their chosen pronouns) considered innocent. They would use extreme measures to do it though like killing a mugger. So from the start, he always tried to do good.
I would definitely put Deadpool in this category though. Deadpool was first introduced by taking out the X-men. A couple of miniseries of him going up against the Juggernaut, people asked more from him. The "merc with the mouth", which seemed like a villain rip off of Spider-man, turned to a psycho then to a good guy through a change of heart. His character changes with each new series.
Magneto has repeatedly had turns of being extermonationist against regular humans, and even when he isn't he's still often portrayed as mutant nationalist, modelling his vision for Genosha off of Israel, which he has repeatedly stated his support of in a very "You lived through the logical conclusion of that shit personally, how are you THIS determined to still get it wrong‽"
Poison Ivy has turns of being an eco-fascist, and her more just being an anti-social eco-anti-hero now is often billed as being a direct result of her treatment at Arkham when before she wanted to actually kill everything but plants. Not even all humans, all everything that isn't either a plant or a plant symbiote, and while that would be am incredible spec-evo project, it would also make her the single most genocidal psychopath in earth's history assuming lichens don't achieve sapience to start making a contest of it.
For just wanting to save his wife, Mr. Freeze sure has a lot of arrests on his record involving trying to plunge gotham into a new ice age, which, just look at Extra History's series on the little ice age to get an idea of just how horrible doing that on purpose to a society is.
Stop whitewashing terrible people who just happen to even tangentially look like a cause you agree with.
That's how we get Joker being seen as justified because one too many people feel personally attacked for cat calling women to smile more and ....motherfucker I think I just figured out why the incels latched onto him so hard.
Carnage redemption arc when?
When Carnage brutally murders a bunch of billionaires.
You joke but the people who try to act like Ivy has always been good and not just a recovered formerly genocidal mental patient would ABSOLUTELY start jerking off Carnage over a killing spree around the ultrawealthy.
Reagan is popular to blame but this suggests it started before him.
People hate and fear black people or gay people out of ignorance and stupidity. People fear mutants because they cap rip out all the iron in someone's body. They have the power of a million mass shooters in one hand.
Some of them have the power of of a million mass shooters. Some of them have the power of a very long neck. Seriously, there an X-man with the codename Longneck because he has a very long neck. He's never once helped the team in the field, because he's completely powerless unless he wants to look over toilet stall walls while pooping.
He does have longer arms to match his neck, but that's it. I guess he can easily get stuff off a high shelf...
And pointedly he cannot blend in as a normal human, so his introduction to the team was them saving him from a lynch mob.
Yeah, but that that does not mean we can ignore the fact some can just level a city if they are in a bad mood. My point is that xmen is a pretty shit allegory.
I'm imagining the mob standing around the guy scratching their heads, with the noose pulled all the way up to the branch.
I dunno, sometimes I see somebody acting monstrously and wish an alien abomination would have him for lunch.
I am pretty sure that racism existed before Reagan became president.
Can someone explain this like I'm five?
