Biden surrogates brushed off questions about reining in the court, while emphasizing the gravity of a second Trump term.
On Monday, the Supreme Court ruled that American presidents have “absolute immunity” from prosecution for any “official acts” they take while in office. For President Joe Biden, this should be great news. Suddenly a host of previously unthinkable options have opened up to him: He could dispatch Seal Team 6 to Mar-A-Lago with orders to neutralize the “primary threat to freedom and democracy” in the United States. He could issue an edict that all digital or physical evidence of his debate performance last week be destroyed. Or he could just use this chilling partisan decision, the latest 6-3 ruling in a term that was characterized by a staggering number of them, as an opportunity to finally embrace the movement to reform the Supreme Court.
But Biden is not planning to do any of that. Shortly after the Supreme Court delivered its decision in Trump v. The United States, the Biden campaign held a press call with surrogates, including Harry Dunn, a Capitol police officer who was on duty the day Trump supporters stormed the building on Jan. 6; Reps. Dan Goldman (D-N.Y.) and Jasmine Crockett (D-Texas); and deputy campaign manager Quentin Fulks.
Their message was simple: It’s terrifying to contemplate what Donald Trump might do with these powers if he’s reelected.
“We have to do everything in our power to stop him,” Fulks said.
Everything, that is, except take material action to rein in the increasingly lawless and openly right-wing Supreme Court.
Biden once again bringing a deck of cards to a gunfight because responding effectively and proportionally in a situation that desperatetly calls for it wOuLd bE DiVisiVE.
THIS position is a justification for calling for him to step down from the candidacy, because refusing to even consider reforming - let alone packing (or, dare I say, the newly-revealed presidentially-legal-if-“official” extralegal and violent unpacking) the Supreme Court is very obviously going to lead to the long term failure of not only the Democratic Party, but democracy in this country in general.
It's fine if Biden doesn't want to play by the new rules – admirable in fact – but we have to understand that this is the game we're playing now. Either learn to play the game or take your ball and go home.
Biden isn't a fascist and neither are the people he appointed. Even if he gave an illegal order, it wouldn't be followed because his administration isn't stocked with incompetent lackies chosen for their loyalty alone.
Stacy Gilbert, who served in the State Department's Bureau of Population, Refugees and Migration, left in late May. She said she resigned over an administration report to Congress that she said falsely stated Israel was not blocking humanitarian aid to Gaza.
Alexander Smith, a contractor for USAID, quit in late May, alleging censorship after the U.S. foreign aid agency canceled publication of his presentation on maternal and child mortality among Palestinians. The agency said it had not gone through proper review and approval.
Looks like everyone that doesn't get in line with Blue MAGA is getting the boot to me.
It's astonishing that a man of his age is still flexible enough to stick his head up his own ass. He still thinks he can work with conservatives, doesn't he?
I hate when people use the original version of that rule because it's never a good lense. The original should be 'Never attribute to stupidity what can be attributed to profit', or do people really think the world is run by idiots who just accidentally managed to profit off of every single time things got worse.
Conservatives, I understand. They're sick, and toxic, but they fight for what they believe in. Which is why we have to defeat them, and why we have to fight back so hard.
But Liberals, man, I just don't get it. Like zero goddamn fight in them. No political will. Not in my lifetime anyway. "Hey we're kinda less shitty than fascists, vote Democrat."
And I have to, but like, only to keep from sliding into the abyss in my own lifetime. So inspiring. Time to start over.
Because libs self-limit. And that's because they believe themselves to be "good" people. "Good people don't do that." Thinking that you're good while your foe is evil or ungood is a type of hubris.
You are confusing liberals and centrist democrats. Biden and his other centrists are not putting up a fight at all. While liberals like AOC, Sanders and porter have been fighting since day 1. I'm a liberal and every traitor connected to this coup should be hung.
Because they actually believe in democracy and believe that it's the people that should prove they disagree by not electing Republicans but again and again the people prove in high enough numbers that they would rather vote against their best interests.
It is a fundamental misunderstanding and mistake to believe that people don't vote the way you want them too is because they are less intelligent than you.
We’re here, and we’re waiting for the rest of the populace to figure it out. Because we can’t start a revolution on our own. But you need to realize that people will die for this cause, maybe even you. Are you really ready to fight?
Exactly, which is why he should say "Fuck it!" abuse his power to the n-th degree to save American democracy and then face the consequences.
If I'm Biden I'd have a bill introduce to reform SCOTUS, Presidential powers, campaign finance, election administration, and more and say, "I expect this on my desk in a weeks time. I fear for the safety of our nation and our elected leaders if these issues go unaddressed."
Then if a week goes by and no bill is ready to sign, two Representatives and two Senators (two Rs and two Ds) go missing. Another week? Another four go missing. This can easily repeat for 12 weeks before a majority of the Senate goes missing. Then, perhaps, some family members of the remaining legislators go missing. 🤷
If Trump wins, Biden and his wife will both likely be killed at Trump's orders. Trump is already calling for Military Tribunals for his political enemies. Show trials where he can have them all sentenced to death.
Biden's name is on Trumps list, right up near the top.
Wouldn't the correct move be to immediately prove why such a ruling is asinine? Use official powers to reform the court, new court removes dangerous ruling asap, guard rail repaired.
Then signal to the rest that you'd like them to review this latest decision while you're deciding on your nominee to fill the vacancy.
And literally hours after McConnell says it's too close to an election to have a confirmation, have him killed too.
Then ask his replacement (Cornyn? Graham? Hawley?) to pretty please hold a confirmation vote before your special ops team has a chance to get a few hours of sleep and a hot meal and they're ready to roll again.
I don't know exactly what the limits of his powers are, but at the most extreme couldn't he blockade the homes of the conservative justices, preventing them from fulfilling their duties? If any official act is immune, why not go all the way? I guess it could get him impeached, which probably wouldn't be great for November, but it feels like something has got to give at this point, these rulings have been beyond the pale.
Yeah. All he had to do was ask him who won the last election and watch him melt down. That was it. Instead he told us how he "defeated Medicare." We're screwed.
Remember when they served him a softball on abortion and somehow he managed to change the subject to an immigrant killing a white woman. Fucking insane
Reforming the Supreme Court was basically Pete's thing during the primaries. He was talking about it years before Roe, Chevron, and absolute immunity. He suggested adding 6 more judges, 5 of which would be rotating appointments by the other 10. It's a shame Biden won't do anything about this - especially when there are other leaders in the party who would.
Didn't appreciate where his overall platform ended up, but his court plan was awesome. It's very much at the point where it needs serious reform beyond just judicial ethics and balancing the numbers.
Loss of advantage will certainly feel like a sting to conservatives, but it's a plan that has some fundamental appeal to fairness. Of course since then the court has gone 6-3, so instituting a 5-5 split would require actually getting rid of a sitting justice.
I agree that we have no idea if he'd actually go through with reforming the court if given the opportunity - I'm just pointing out that Democrats have openly called for reforming the court, on the presidential debate stage, as recently as 2019. It shouldn't be viewed as a non-starter - especially when these ideas were coming from the so-called moderate wing of the party.
On the M4A topic, it's crazy to me how its supporters have managed to ally themselves with the private healthcare lobby in opposing a competitive public option. If Medicare is more efficient than profit-driven insurance, as we all suspect, then forcing private insurance to compete with it puts us on a direct path to a single-payer system. Pete is a democratic capitalist - it shouldn't be a surprise that his version of M4A uses the system in place to get us there. If Bernie amended his bill to include a 15-year transition plan I doubt anyone would accuse him of flip-flopping.
The SC literally just granted this power. What was he supposed to do, force them not to release the ruling? He could not have packed the court in any way to cancel out this 6-3 majority in time
Thanks, you fucking primary DNC voters.
how would that change the ruling?? It is not a simple thing at all to reform the highest court, especially amidst these last few insane years. Biden or another D, it is not something that can just be done. You're acting like Biden had the chance to just sit down in a chair but chose not to.
You should be thanking the unelected supreme court fascists.
this is the executive branch refusing to put checks on a clearly corrupt and dysfunctional judicial branch. The stability of our 3 branch system depends on the branches being willing and able to check each other. If one branch yields to another, the system fails.
I agree. This is within the president's role to fix.
Biden, you are head of the executive branch. Your job is to ensure the law is followed. Do your job and start making them do theirs. It doesn't have to be bloody but applying some pressure would be a great start.
If you dont try to fight fascism with every tool avaliable and legal to you, then you're a fascist. There's no if and or buts about it. Biden could take steps to counter fascism but instead he make committments to explicitly not fight it using the new SCOTUS ruling and even not to change the courts.
Even if he wins, in 4 years were going to be right back to fascism because he is explicitly refusing to fix this. Hes unfit to fight fascism which means hes unfit to be president in the modern US.
Sure. We'll just have a nice nap while the Christo-fascists take over the World's most powerful nuclear state. At least they'll know we took the high road!
I promise you that trump and the Christo-fascist movement that he represents will be very creative and forceful wielding this power. For Biden and the Democratic leadership to asymmetrically disarm is yet another example of why the fascists keep advancing despite being unpopular on nearly every issue. The allegiance to decorum and gentlemanly procedure is killing us. Remember when Obama just let them steal a Supreme Court seat, without any fight at all? Hell, remember when Gore just cowardly backed down and ceded his win for the good of the country? I’ll say it again. Every bit of awfulness that Republican authoritarians are successfully persecuting is actively enabled by a pathologically cowardly, ineffective Democratic Party. Biden is exactly the wrong leader for this moment in history.
Because of course they did. God forbid a dem take any kind of unseemly action. Instead, we got a 5min press conference about how unacceptable it all is.
The Democrats aren't going to "save you". They like having the Boogeyman of Trump or <insert crazy Republican> to get you to vote in "the most important election in our lifetime".
Don't get me wrong, Trump and the Republicans will do more damage socially, but the Democrats couldn't/didn't/won't stop that even when they control(ed) the White House, House of Representative, and the Senate.
Remember folks that this argument falls apart the instant you look at policies. Trump and his cronies will do more damage socially and in every other imaginable way. While not perfect, I feel the Democratic side can be fixed. There is no fixing the vicious and malicious mockery that is the modern Republican Party. For now, and if we fight, the Democrats do still listen when under pressure at least some of the time.
So let's start artificially creating that supply, by demanding.
They are an existential threat to our freedom and democracy! We have to do everything in our power to stop them! Except, you know, doing anything. That would be inconceivable.
That edit is the whole problem democrats don’t have any consequences for being shitty. If this election is so important than fucking do something popular Jesus Christ.
That edit is the whole problem democrats don’t have any consequences for being shitty.
yeah! Let's just not vote at all and hand trump and the federalist society the election!
If this election is so important than fucking do something popular Jesus Christ.
Biden has done a FUCK TON of stuff for the average american, especially in the face of the do-nothing MAGA congress. You're mad because Biden isn't immediately whipping his dick out to fuck over the supreme court with the insane amount of power they just handed him? Grow the fuck up, jesus christ. The LAST thing we need are knee-jerk emotional reactions instead of calculated tactics.
Read the article, not the headline, he's not saying he won't do it or would veto legislation around it. He says he'll consider court reform. He's "dismissing it" as a thing to focus on right now because you need an an unrealistic amount of congressional votes to pack the court. Good luck with that. The supreme court interprets laws, with less votes than you need to expand it, you can write blisteringly clear legislation that leaves no room for interpretation. Supreme court problem solved.
No matter how clear your law is, if SCOTUS doesn’t like it, they can just declare it unconstitutional after the first yahoo with standing sues the government.
Biden has already prerecorded his congratulations to trump phone call and plans on sending it a week before the election. He believes it's the only option available to him under the constitution and prevailing sense of political realism.
I dunno, my non-drinking finnish acquaintance and former gaming buddy (Stupid RL getting in the way all the time) regularly rants about the idiocy of his countrymen during hockey season. :P
If I call you lazy for not doing something I just want to shame you into doing that something for free. I could have paid you to do it, or I could have done it myself, but instead I call you lazy and hope your sense of shame is enough to get you moving for me.
There is no actual real laziness anywhere.
There are people and their interests. People pursue their interests the best way they know how.
There are no good, bad, lazy, hard-working people in reality.
At this point, what benefit is there of doing nothing and "following the rules"?
If Biden wins, then what? It doesn't fix any of the BS the supreme Court has created it just buys a couple more years until Trump tries again or the next Rep maga agent comes along. Looking at the state of the Republican party, this would be almost any of them at this point then the US is in the exact same position.
They can't hold off the Republicans forever.
Of course if he does reset the court, jails or executes Trump then that plays directly into the hands of the crazies too "SEE! We told you he's trying to take over democracy!!"
We're afraid of the threat that they'll keep doing what they're doing right now. Why? They're already doing it. We're idiots for letting it affect our decisions.
I hear you for sure but if Biden wins we get four years to figure this shit out and get a younger candidate on the Dem ballot. Maybe more progressive maybe not but not fall of Rome shit like we will get with Trump. I truly think that if Trump loses this election he's through. He might die during his term even if he wins it. But if he loses, and especially if he later dies or goes to prison, MAGA will implode.
I don't know what the fallout will look like if we ever see the dawn of that shining opportunity, but this will be the time to push left hard.
I don’t understand how he can make changes to the Supreme Court using this new Supreme Court ruling. My understanding is that change requires Congress and the recent ruling just means he can’t be held accountable for crimes committed as official acts.
What crimes are being suggested to change the Supreme Court?
Kill the judges using his own immunity granted by them. Elect new ones that will take away this immunity. They are very obviously a threat to democracy and they themselves have said that whether something is an official order cannot be questioned.
He doesn't need to kill them. Take all their personal property using eminent domain, sell all their office space in D.C. and close the court buildings where they operate. Leave them running SCOTUS out of a store front in a strip mall in the most crime ridden part of D.C. He could even use extraordinary rendition (Thanks Dubya) to nab their families and hold them in black sites in foreign countries. There are any number of non-lethal official acts that he can use to make their lives a living hell until they consent to make the changes we need to keep this country safe from fascism. When your enemy hands you a gun, use it.
After he was elected, Biden appointed a 36-member bipartisan commission to study potential changes to the Supreme Court -- including the addition of more seats, as well as term limits and a code of ethics for justices.
The commission unanimously adopted a report late last year, in which they warned that excessive change to the institution could cause democracy to regress in the future.
The panel found "considerable" support for 18-year term limits for justices, but the issue of expanding the court beyond nine seats was met with "profound disagreement."
Because the bipartisan commission claimed fixing it would do more harm then letting the current corrupt court do shit like repeal Roe v Wade and all the other shit Biden now says was so terrible.
But if elected again, he still won't fix.
That's a big reason Biden has a 37% approval rating, he opposed actually fixing things. And just wants to maintain the status quo.
It's not a valid long term strategy.
Moderates just want to complain, they don't want to actually fix shit. We've been ignoring it since Obama's pick was stolen, ignoring it more won't magically solve it.
Yeah, that's a good point, I've seen a lot of suggestions that seem to go beyond the scope of this terrible terrible ruling. I guess he could order the military to prevent congress and the SC from meeting or doing anything. Then he could just issue executive orders, or declare war on a faction of politicians trying to stage a coup maybe?
That’s what it sounded like to me also but I didn’t want to jump to conclusions.
Are these people suggesting that Biden assassinate politicians and stage a coup arguing in good faith? Seems like something that would be suggested by an enemy nation.
What about the voters that are voting Biden because they don’t want a coup or assassinations? Biden would lose all those votes. Then how does he win the election?
TFG is a threat to democracy. but we won't do anything about it. please vote harder.
no system can survive without mechanisms to protect itself. if a person is immunocompromised, a simple illness can destroy their body. if your computer doesn't have an antivirus, a simple virus can take over the whole system.
if your democracy doesn't have a way to extinguish fascism before it takes over, don't expect democracy to survive it by chance.
The reality is the democrats can't reform the supreme court, because they don't control the House of Representatives, and barely control the Senate.
To enact reform of that type they would need solid majorities in both chambers and control of the presidency. That remains very unlikely. Even simple ideas like expanding the court rather than meaningful reform is impossible as no nominees would get through congress.
It makes sense the democrats make their campaign focused on Donald Trump. And as bad as the supreme court is at the moment, the democrats have bigger issues to deal with - a lacklustre campaign with a poor candidate. It'll be hard enough trying to convince people Biden is a good choice as a candidate, let alone move into complex areas like judicial reform.
The reality is the democrats can’t reform the supreme court, because they don’t control the House of Representatives, and barely control the Senate.
The Supreme Court literally just said Biden can do whatever the fuck he wants as long as it's an "official" act, including having the conservative Justices assassinated and replaced by people he picks himself, confirmed by the Senate or not.
Suddenly a host of previously unthinkable options have opened up to him: He could dispatch Seal Team 6 to Mar-A-Lago with orders to neutralize the “primary threat to freedom and democracy” in the United States.
Or he could just use this chilling partisan decision, the latest 6-3 ruling in a term that was characterized by a staggering number of them, as an opportunity to finally embrace the movement to reform the Supreme Court.
Shortly after the Supreme Court delivered its decision in Trump v. The United States, the Biden campaign held a press call with surrogates, including Harry Dunn, a Capitol police officer who was on duty the day Trump supporters stormed the building on Jan. 6; Reps. Dan Goldman (D-N.Y.) and Jasmine Crockett (D-Texas); and deputy campaign manager Quentin Fulks.
Under pressure in 2020, then-candidate Biden promised that, if elected, he would appoint a bipartisan commission to consider reforms to the Supreme Court and the federal judiciary.
It’s worth noting, he offered that pledge before the court overturned Roe v. Wade, before it struck down a Trump-era ban on the device that facilitated the deadliest mass shooting in American history, and before it ended affirmative action in college admissions.
Asked what the campaign’s message to voters who have watched as the court has delivered a stream of deeply partisan decisions and who believe the system is broken, and who want to know what Biden would do to fix it in a second term, Fulks offered: “We’re going to continue to make the case and talk to voters about the fact that the judges that Donald Trump put on the court have, honestly, taken away rights from Americans and given more freedom to Donald Trump as president United States to do whatever he wants … This campaign is gonna spend every day from now until November continuing to make that case that if Donald Trump gets anywhere near the White House again, he will do exactly what he has been telling us for months.
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Roosevelt needed the support of congress for that, which Biden doesn’t have. Unless you want him to order assassins or a military coup, I don’t think there’s anything he can do.
I would definitely like him more if he did the latter. So there is something he can do and his enemies just gave him the ability but he's too much of a doormat to fascists to use it.
"Official Acts" are the acts within the powers granted by the constitution, and acts of Congress. Biden (and any future presidents) can't just punch someone, say "I officially punch you!" and get off the hook.
This is similar to the immunity every judge and prosecutor in the country gets. Basically, inb4 the only result of this ruling is a few charges against Trump are dropped.
He can officially defend the country and constitution by ordering the arrest of all of the seditious representatives, and remove the recent supreme courts justices for lying under oath.
The official vs unofficial part will be determined by the courts. I assume most cases involving the President will go to the Supreme Court. Do you see the issue here?
well he cant reform the supreme court. Doing that would not be affected by this immunity descision. Its still a crime to follow unlawful orders from an immune president.
He could use the military to strong arm either congress or the Supreme Court to make them rule/legislate as he wants. He could just pardon anyone he has following his unlawful orders as well.
For all of you urging Biden to abuse these ridiculous new powers... Are you nuts? Part of Biden's appeal is that he's the sane one, not the demented orange baboon. If he starts behaving just like that festering asshole, he's going to lose a lot of that appeal. A lot of people will go, "Well, if my choice is between a shit sandwich and a shit salad, I'm not eating at this restaurant," and stay home on election day.
So after the debate i kinda think the election is already doomed. But let’s pretend it’s not. We are looking at four possible out comes. 1. Biden wins by doing nothing, he may or may not attempt to abuse this new power, either way the hostile Supreme Court will have an emergency session and rule against Biden, preventing him from using it. The trap has been laid. 2. Trump wins with Biden doing nothing. Trump uses official action to do everything he swears he would do including military retaliation against his rivals, showing Isreal how to do a real genocide, ect. The trap has sprung. 3. Trump wins because Biden abused these powers and attacked the Supreme Court before they could declare it a non official action. The powers are stripped from the president, we have terrible 4 years, only mitigated by the restriction on presidential powers. The trap misfires. 4. Biden wins even after abusing official actions to attack the hostile Supreme Court, then replacing the justices. We have another 4 Biden years filled with Fox News screeching how he is a dictator. The trap is disarmed.
Mathematically, non-voters just voted for whoever wins. So, if you are anti-trump (or all the other evil he stands for) and he wins, but you didn't vote...you voted for him.
Because it's a stupid idea. Some Democrats and Liberals want to completely change our political system, judicial system, and Constitution, because thy're not getting their way? It's fucking stupid. Trump was in office and was able to appoint who he wanted...it's pure luck that things worked out in his favor during his Presidency... t's a cycle that will continue when he's long gone and some hardcore liberal President does the same... we don't change everything because one side is upset. STFU Democrats.
Except it wasn't pure luck things worked out for Trumps term regarding the SC appointees. Obama was able to pick one or two which was blocked and vetoed and filibustered by the cons for years until their guy was there.
I love how I can be called every single name in the book on Lemmy and Reddit for having a different opinion, but for some reason, when I retaliate, I'm banned, threatened, or warned... funny how ultra Liberal these sites have become...