You can be damned sure the crazy fundamentalists are gonna have a shit ton of kids. And some of those will vote.
no toilet paper?
100% of scientists agree that not-having-kids will solve our climate change crisis in one generation.
It'll take more than one...
Well since we can't count on our leaders to be responsible
lol, yes Millennials and Gen Z are trying so much harder to fix the situation by voting for change… ohhh wait
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/yes-trump-improved-young-men-drew-young-women-rcna179019
Yeah I’m afraid that the lesson is that Gen Z is not actually the future, they are going to repeat the past. What makes me sad is that they should have been the future but social media made sure that didn’t happen.
but the system is rigged or my vote doesn't count or genocide joe or some stupid shit
Look at this guy thinking that we can vote our way out of this when we only have two, corporate sponsored, candidates.
If I ever decide to have kids then I'm adopting because I can't in good conscience bring a life into this shitty world
Craziest thing about this graphic is that it leaves so many major issues off while also covering so much horseshit.
I mean it's clearly a pandemic era comic. The whole no toilet paper thing and deadly viruses.
Was gonna say, wheres the fascism going retro?
no board is big enough to put all the problems
We didn't start the fire. It was always burning since the world's been turning.
Yeah I don't really get comics like these, or any other form of "[my generation] has it the worst, the world had been destroyed, why should I have kids" that more or less ignores all of history.
For context, I'm gen Z/millennial with a child and planning another with my wife. We're not rich or living in nice city of whatever, just living in a smaller city in Europe.
Oh thank god one person on this threat who is not opposed to children or straight out antinatalist
garbage health care
mass shootings
violent racism
The US is far from the only country with violent racism. In terms of healthcare, the privatization. The Canadian healthcare system is being increasingly enshittified by conservatives up here, too.
Look at this guy who thinks the USA invented racism and holds a monopoly on it.
I mean, the UK has 2 out of 3 of those. And most countries have the violent racism.
Most countries have racism, some have violent racism... and there are some in which terrorist organizations like KKK are freely roaming the streets and are ok for some reason.
Anyway, it feels wierd to speak shit of the USA when there currently are countries actively working on ethnic cleansing.
the UK has 2 out of 3 of those
Change "shooting" to "knifing" and its 3 for 3. The UK has a huge hooliganism problem. The country is rife with domestic violence. But no (non-police) guns!
RIP Alaska, Hawaii, and Michigan's Upper Peninsula
When we go down we are taking all of you with us.
Don’t worry we know
r/iam14andthisisdeep
At this point I think the GOP are just taunting people who won't bring kids into this. Jokes on them though, if theyre having kids from some sort obligation and not to love and properly nurture them it's just bad news for everyone involved. Have fun with all that trauma.
Conservatives are often very insecure people who have never overcome their own childhood trauma or understood why they want children. That trauma and insecurity just gets passed down.
I know, I'm the child of two. For the last 20 years I've been completely isolated from all my family by no doing of my own. I often wonder what the fuck all that was about. You know, the whole, bringing 4 kids into the world then putting fasicists into power. Like I got problems, true, but I'd of prefered keeping myself and not being a plague to those around me.
Republicans saying they hate Communism, then doing a Nicolae Ceaușescu speed run.
Thats one of the reasons i'm not having kids. I have a decent life by any metric but I had to work my ass off and face a tonne of resistance in my career. It always feels like I'm playing catch up with the cost of everything going up and up to the point where I'm just exhausted and depressed. Like, what is the point of living?! it honestly feels like theres just nothing left to enjoy anymore, everything has been monetized to hell and back. They told us as kids that you can be anything you want when you grow up, the future is bright and if you work hard you will be rewarded and its just not true. I can't do that to another person, these problems are only getting worse with no end in sight.
That's the point? The left get demoralized and the right can't be because they have no morals. Its part of the reason right wingers tend to have a dozen children, it's quite literally biblical drown them in numbers bullshit.
DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN REPEAT DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN
THIS MESSAGE IS FOR ALL RESIDENTS OF PLANET EARTH
NO ONE NEEDS YOU TO BIRTH THEM
ABORT. ABORT. ABORT.
WE HAVE ENOUGH PEOPLE, THE PLANET IS BURNING, THEY WILL NOT LEAD GOOD LIVES. IT'S NOT WORTH IT. PULL OUT BEFORE YOU NUT HOLY CHRIST PLEASE DO NOT HAVE KIDS
This is mostly copied over from my recent comments elsewhere, but it is very relevant here too.
By 2030 we are going to be 40% over capacity on fresh water resources globally. and 40% of arable land has already been depleted, and 95% will be by 2050.
And that's just water and food.
Once arctic ice sheet coverage gets below 1,000,000 square kilometres, the planet will be absorbing more heat than it reflects and this is called a Blue Ocean Event.
The BOE will trigger the Clathrate Gun which will cause seabeds to rapidly realease fuck tons of methane, cooking the earth in it's own atmosphere.
2024 Arctic sea ice likely reached its annual minimum extent of 4.28 million square kilometers.
Greenhouse gas emissions are still increasing and fuelled by climate change, the world's oceans have broken temperature records every single day over the past year.
So it's basically a race between whether the drought and famine kill us all first, or the BOE setting off the Clathrate Gun will.
Either way, it is unlikely the human race survives the century. Creating more people to suffer in this dying world, is stupid and cruel and is only going to speed up our demise.
Please consider adoption as an alternative if you are in a stable situation and want children.
You don’t even have to be in a stable situation to be a Big Brother/Sister at your local Boys and Girls club or a court advocate/CASA for a child. Volunteer at a school district. Children recognize how fucked everything is, and on the whole they are suffering. We need kind and loving adults to show up for them - to teach them art and read them stories to show them the parts of living that can hopefully make it worth it.
My SO and I have both decided that we definitely don't want kids but would discuss the subject if any one of us seriously considered it for one reason or another. What we agreed on, though, is to look for adoption rather than biological children. We both have stuff we'd rather not pass along, firstly, and secondly, there's so many children that don't have any family. It's sorta like "adopt don't shop", if you will.
or wood chipper
Just get a vasectomy honestly. You can keep nutting inside afterwards. Deal?
i'll take two
Speak for yourself I've got a vasectomy
The catch-22 is that if the people with environmental values don't have kids, those values aren't passed on to the next generation (unless they become teachers or media personalities).
You don’t need to have kids to pass on values. The basic premise of your statement doesn’t hold up.
Well, like I mentioned you still need some sort of interaction with kids. Or maybe influence their parents enough to have them indirectly pass on those values you imparted on them. But I still think that if the smartest, kindest, most compassionate people among us stop having kids... well then that's not great for that next generation. I've just always felt that giving up one of the primary factors of life, reproduction, seems very defeatist. But on the other hand, if someone genuinely doesn't want children then by all means don't.
lol fucking obliterated
Any society that doesn't impart those values across the board to its citizens will devolve into shit regardless.
It's basically just math.
People with zero values are going to fuck like rabbits and people with values aren't.
If trash family has 5 kids they can't take care of and a dad that leaves, that's at least 4 really mad poor kids that are going to blame a lot on somesuch minority for their problems in 18 years.
It seems like vanishingly few people in the US care about the good of broader humanity anymore. Destroying the environment is fine as long as it creates jobs. Poisoning the water tables forever with fracking is fine as long as it makes cheap gas. Genocide was supported by both parties in the last election. Both parties are waving guns around even as school kids die in ever more frequent mass shootings. Its a race to the bottom and no one cares to change course.
For all those values, even in yourself. There’s no better motivator to make an effort for the future, than having a kid you want the best for. If you don’t have a kid, you’re not passing your environmental values, or you educational values, or all the other values you may have for what makes a better society. Nor do you have any reason to hold to them yourself.
I don’t mean to try to push anyone toward having kids, but if you do want to have kids but give up thinking the world is getting worse, that decision is part of the world getting worse. If you do want kids, there’s all sorts of opportunity to make this a better world for both yourself and them, and longer, and plenty of opportunity to make an actual difference
Just passing along the value of the bidet may be worth it, according to the comic
If you don’t have a kid, you’re not passing your environmental values, or you educational values, or all the other values you may have for what makes a better society. Nor do you have any reason to hold to them yourself.
...
Why does it have to be my kid for me to care?
Like actually. Are you seriously saying being a parent somehow intrinsically makes someone a better, more caring, and impactful, person? Or that parenthood is the only way to achieve true conviction? That's literally not how any of this works.
Not bringing children into the world in no way prevents you from caring about making the world a better place, and acting to make it so. And doing the things that make the world better doesn't functionally require having a kid. All it takes is some basic fucking decency.
Which is something people already have, but get taken away by the grind of survival or material success. That is maybe why you have this fucked up idea that people get it by having a kid, but in reality that's just a huge life event that wakes some people up enough to take a look around and start caring again.
And passing good things on doesn't require having descendants. If you've ever changed someones mind on something for the better, you've successfully passed on "values you may have for what makes a better society". The person whose mind you changed doesn't even need to be younger than you, thought doesn't procreate through fucking genetics.
Plenty of parents are made no more profound than they were before by the act of procreating, and will conently continue to do nothing to improve the world. There are parents who will protect their own to the detriment of everyone else.
Kids though, if raised by caring parents, care from the start, but then have that heart crushed by society until they too have a kid of their own.
But in there is way for everyone to care, all the time.
The whole idea that it's ok not to care about and deal with bad stuff unless you personally are somehow impacted is the whole reason we're in this mess, and it's perpetuated by people being forced to live in a constant scramble of stress and consumerism.
Not by people not having children.
I don't need to have a child to care about passing down a habitable planet to the next generation.
What is the acceptable level of tragedy to impart upon a non-consenting progeny? I vote for zero
You'd have to be immortal, first. Most kids are gonna live to see their own parents pass.
Tragedy is a part of life.
It's easily avoidable tragedy, unaddressed by those who could do something about it, that's the problem.
Even worse, there's potentially extinction level tragedy happening right now, going unaddressed by those who can do something about it.
Tragedy is a part of life
Yes. And tragedy is categorically bad, and tragedies cannot be experienced by that which is not alive (i.e. non-sentient). Thusly, a total absence of (sentient) life would be a total absence of tragedies and vice versa; in other words, sentient life and tragedy are virtually biconditional. The continuation of sentient life and tragedy is wholly avoidable if the relevant capable parties were willing, and it can often be abated on a small scale on an individual basis.
Most kids though? I'm not going to go looking for stats but let's just say 95% of children are outliving their parents right now. Awkward sentence there. I mean parents who are dying today, 95% of them didn't outlive their children. I hope that makes sense. Yes that's not how statistics work, I'm trying to make a point.
What's an acceptable level to drop to before we say fuck this we're done having kids? I knew I didn't want kids when I was a kid, but I'm an outlier.
Let's say 85% is the number for kids born today. I believe that's already unacceptable. It's so unnatural.
I think the number is worse than that. The mass climate migration/water wars are going to really get moving in the 2040s if not earlier. I don't want to live through that. I definitely don't want a child to live through that.
I'm Gen X, but cusp with Millennial. I said at 15 or 16 I'd never have kids & stuck with it. I'm more resolute than ever & feel like I would have massive guilt if I had caved. I felt the world was too fucked up back in the 90s. I wonder how my younger self would deal with the world today.
I'm on the other side of the generational gap (nearly gen x, but millennial), and I was terrified during my late teens/early 20s of becoming a parent. I could not imagine raising a child the way I was living paycheque to paycheque, if I had a paycheque at all....
That feeling never went away, and I still wouldn't know how I could possibly afford that. I decided in my mid 20s that children would be a decision I would leave up to my wife (wherever I had a wife to make the decision). I was/am instinctually driven to want them (a feeling I mostly disregard), but given the state of the world and my own financial situation, I can't say that I want to force any intelligent being, especially one that is my offspring, to suffer through a lifetime of this shit like I have been forced to so far.
I didn't ask to be here. If someone had given me a choice, I would have probably opted out of gestures all of this.
I'm currently in a long term relationship, and we're planning on signing the papers next year, so soon I'll have someone I can legitimately call my wife. She is very much on the side of "never have kids". So that's my decision as well.
Instinctual drive isn't enough to cause me to overlook how things are going. I love my (non-existent) children too much, than to force them into living a life in these circumstances. Fuck no.
I was/am instinctually driven to want them (a feeling I mostly disregard), but given the state of the world and my own financial situation, I can’t say that I want to force any intelligent being, especially one that is my offspring, to suffer through a lifetime of this shit like I have been forced to so far.
This is interesting to me, as I've never had the biological urge to have kids. I love them and enjoy hanging out with them, joking, playing, etc., but never my own. In any case, I commend you on being resolute.
I’m currently in a long term relationship, and we’re planning on signing the papers next year, so soon I’ll have someone I can legitimately call my wife. She is very much on the side of “never have kids”. So that’s my decision as well.
My girlfriend doesn't want them either. She's a good deal younger than me - 31 years old - but she says something similar to me: raising kids in this world would be a tragedy.
Frankly, I've always felt there are too many humans. I never understood the push for more. Just maintain or reduce the population naturally.
Good luck staving off that biological imperative. I feel lucky not to have it myself.
The trouble with this graphic is that millennials are part of the problem now. The oldest are over forty. We've all seen the footage of Jan 6th. There were very few boomers in their 60 and 70s.
There's a whole fucking generation between Boomers and Millennials. Yes, Gen X does get overlooked often, that's the running joke. But they're far more likely to have soaked up Boomerisms and benefited from better economic ROI than Millennials who hit college just at the cusp of the 2000s, and for whom everything thereafter has been a shit toboggan.
Don't forget the Millennials who graduated high school/college during the 08 housing crisis.
Dr. Toboggan! Dr. Shit Toboggan!
And we just saw the first corrupt Millennials enter office this election.
It will be 20 more years before the Millennials are the geritocracy and hold any real power
By then our country will be over
Matt Gaetz is an elder millennial like me, and he is a fucking dipshit... and he's going to be attorney general of the United States despite being a proven pedophile and having committed statutory rape AND has mininal legal experience.
Why do you think the politicians that are accelerating inequality are the same politicians that are trying to outlaw abortion?
They want babies because they need more workers to distribute inequality and produce more wealth for the shareholders. Foster kids are less likely to go to college, so they’re perfect fuel for the machine.
Don't forget soldiers. As George Carlin said, "Live babies make dead soldiers."
When in human history was ever a good time to have children?
Is there an objective "this was the best year/decade/century"?
That’s the neat part, there isn’t!
But being more serious: I think I can express the feeling of things being particularly worse now in a way that isn’t just recency bias.
Sure, over time technology has improved and that’s generally speaking allowed for better standards of living, at least for the people at the right end of that technology. (Not so great if you’re being conquered because someone shows up with guns for example.) So you could look at the past and say it was worse because materially things like food availability and medicine have become better over time.
But key to this was that all of this was a struggle of humans over nature. To the extent things were bad, there were tangible things we could do to improve.
These days, so many of our problems are self-inflicted and technology and economic development mostly makes them worse. Climate change is the obvious big one, but then there’s stuff like:
-
Weapons have become increasingly destructive and centrally usable. A small number of people can cause a lot more damage than they ever could in the past.
-
Surveillance technology invades our privacy in a way that’s unprecedented in human history.
-
Automation, communications, and transportation technology have made workers less and less powerful and therefore more subject to abuse and artificial poverty. This is one of the more messed up things about capitalism. Technology gets better and rather than getting the benefits of that progress, it actually hurts a lot of people.
-
Advances in science and technology, particularly data science, allow the powerful to hyper-optimize the bad things they were always doing or enables them to do things they’ve wanted to do.
-
A financialized economy creates economic catastrophes where people go homeless or starve without any actual changes to material conditions. The numbers got screwed up or the investors panicked and now everything sucks for no reason?
-
More generally, we can produce enough of the necessities of life for everyone, but capitalism ensures that those necessities won’t make it to people. Capitalism depends on scarcity. If you had a house you wouldn’t need to pay a landlord. If you had food you wouldn’t need to pay food companies. If you had both you wouldn’t need to go work and put up with awful conditions. We’ve solved our most fundamental problems and yet because of the interests of the system and those in power, that progress gets held back.
In the past, even if things were rough now, you could maybe look forward to them improving. Now it feels like the walls are closing in. Unless we actively do something about it, things are going to get worse for most people as more and more wealth accumulates in private hands, as we become subject to increasingly powerful forms of control, and as the powerful destroy the environment we need to live.
-
In the past, children were your labor force, health care and pension plan. People had many children so at least some survived into adulthood. There wasn't much alternative back in the day.
Now children are a net cost. They can't even take care of you in old age if government pensions or retirement plans don't pan out because many can barely feed themselves.
So, the best time to have children was roughly before 1900. That's when things started to change.
Yeah that's how I feel. People still had kids during wars, famines, imprisonment, potential nuclear war. Every problem humans have ever faced really. This is the best time to be alive ever. There are tonne of problems we are going to face in the near future but that has always been the case.
The biggest reasons people are having kids is we're all overweight and feel bad about ourselves and are constantly comparing to people/couples online. We have phone/shopping/gaming addictions to deal with all this mental stress. Online dating is shit. 3rd places don't exist anymore. We are all lonely and meeting someone and figuring everything out to the point where children are an viable option seems impossible. Easier to just say fuck it and just post memes and complain about the world is bad now so I'm not having kids. And to be fair all of that has a lot of truth in it.
Incorrect. The biggest reason people aren't having kids is that the planet is dying and no one can afford them anyway. Life is nothing to do to a person at this point.
Kudos to those not having kids. I've had two recently fully knowing it's going to be tough on them, but I'm going to do the responsible thing and teach them self defense and how to disrespect authority.
Plus as a bonus, I'm going to get those additional family members when we're protecting the homestead from raiders.
No, noone is under any obligation to do so.
Remember what they say on airplanes. Secure your own mask before helping others.
Ironically, if temperature gets to a high degree enough, so much water vapor, methane and carbon dioxide will be on the atmosphere capturing heat (which will eventually escape), but more importantly, reflecting it on the upper atmosphere layers, that we will freeze to death before even feeling the burn LMAO 🤣
Water vapour is quite good at absorbing heat, and it insulates the atmosphere too(it's often warmer at night if its cloudy), would it reflect enough heat for that sort of cooling to happen? Sounds like something that would take a lot longer to happen than the time it will take to get too hot for us to survive without living underground or something.
I fucking wish
Imagine that one guy shoveling fuel on the fire "IF IT GETS A LITTLE BIT WORSE THEN WE CAN RISE UP!"
Sammy Hager? Sheesh.
Every movie has a bad guy and a good guy. Simple stories for simple people.
Give me a break. How about the people having kids in:
- -900,000: Whatever happened to kill off almost all humans
- -1177: Bronze Age collapse
- 535: Volcanic winter of 536
- 1347-1351: Black Death
- 1914-1918: WWI and Spanish Flu
- 1929-1939: Great Depression and Dust Bowl
- 1962: Great Leap Forward
- 1943-1945: Worst killings and bombings of WWII
- 2020: For our lifetimes. COVID and 100 other disasters. So bad most have forgotten it started with Australia burning to the ground, 1 billion animals killed.
As to racism, we watched Mississippi Burning last night. My wife isn't from America and was horrified. "Honey, that was happening when our parents were kids."
Humans didn't evolve until about 300,000 years ago. Humans didn't exist 900,000 years ago.
If we did, it would make us even dumber, since we already spent about 280k years in the dirt before we considered growing food ourselves in one place.
2024+: Climate change, water wars, resultant mass migration, worldwide rise of fascism.
You're right we should have stopped having children millennia ago. I wish my parents never met.
I don't think you understand why people stop having kids, do you? video
This entire thread sums up the utter misery of Lemmy.
It's a fuckin doomer tumor.
Exactly. I love it. These people are basically self pruning their evolutionary branches all by themselves!
There should be a Darwin awards category for this
Intelligence pruning itself out of a malicious environment isn't really a great showcase of evolution.
It's not technically incorrect - we are changing, but a species actively taking steps backwards by inflating itself with idiots doesn't quite hit that stronger/faster/smarter progression that the concept of evolution implies.
These are darwinism's death throes.
So...have kids in a dying world so you have mating success? That's an asinine reason to procreate.
I’m not.
Im amazed at how much X has had kids. Seems nuts. Then I realize I might have done it if I had went 4 years to college and started working right after and if within a few years made a family raising type of wage. That double major and one year in a PhD may have saved me.
A lot of cope in this thread.
These keywords are not prevalent in my country (not the us) but this or a couple of nukes doesn't really make much difference
It doesn't matter where you live. Even if you're in the perfect geography and latitude to make climate change no big deal locally; the mass migration, wars, and production disruption will certainly affect you and especially your children.
I love the part were they kind of observe it in a detached, third person point of view, as if it didn't affect them at all, and taking care of the issue in any way was beyond even their wildest dreams, just because they consider themselves above the issue.
Oh, but by all means, keep self pruning your evolutionary tree branch.
But do try to use those extra resources to last a bit. You don't want to miss the global chaos the lack of social security is gonna create in about 20 to 30 years, it's gonna be sick
The detachment is more of a defeatism issue. When you have zero power to affect change, what the hell else can you do but work through the day and try to not have a breakdown?
Mind you, I vote when that comes around, I just don't have the mental fortitude anymore to not be detached. Don't have the time or space to do more than that, which is rather by design I expect.
I love the fact that you ignore the parents who put them on the planet saying "they can solve it" then going on to destroy be dicks to people and the environment. I love it that you completely forget about the Fridays for Future, Last Generation, the people glueing themselves to the streets in protest, lots of other movements, and the ensuing reaction "oh, you're children, STFU". Funny how selective memory works.
Oh, but by all means, keep self pruning your evolutionary tree branch.
Yes, by all means, keep pumping out units and teaching them to condescend against others online. They'll surely change the world in a positive way. Don't forget to tell your children how nobody did nothing, but you, oh so brave and valiant Shardikprime, forced them into the world to bestow a wonderful life in the climate wars. They'll be so grateful for your thoughtfulness.
The problem is still there. It doesn't care about who started it
Are you sure you have done your absolute best to solve this problem?
Well you can have them, then just say "screw them" cause you got your own problems to deal with as western society would prefer you act.
Their only purpose is to support you when you get old anyways. Everyone knows that.
Honestly if I have a kid it would only to raise them to be a post apocalyptic war lord and hopefully give them a tragic enough backstory to survive the wasteland on.
hopefully give them a tragic enough backstory
What the fuck? Like abuse the shit out of them to toughen them up?
I know you're not being serious but damn what do you mean by this?
Maybe I will hold back a wave of marauders and while they see the door buckling I tell them I love them and they need to fix the world to be a better place where kids don't have to lose their parents then throw them down the escape slide as I turn around to start going with a chainsaw through the enemies.
Maybe I will just name them Chadderick...
I dunno, guess will see what works best in the moment.
Our parents and grandparents had kids - depending on your age - when there was a world war and tens of thousands of people were dying daily in their country, or in the 50 years where the world was always on the brink of getting destroyed in a nuclear apocalypse if one of the two world powers made the wrong move. Were they dumb?
Not to downplay on the current emergencies which are existential and terrifying, especially seeing how little as a species we are doing to address them - but they are a bit of a silly reason not to have kids.
If you don’t want kids don’t have them, you do you :) far too many people have children out of peer or societal pressure or just carelessness, and we could really use much fewer of those, considering the societal damage of absent or careless parenting. But just be honest with yourself, no need to blame viruses and “no toilet paper”.
How many of those kids were intentional though? Birth control and abortion were restricted or just not available. I'm sure most of the people who had kids in the past did not regret it but I'm not going to pretend they meant to get pregnant.
And the toilet paper thing is obviously a joke. A bit of levity in the horror.
Sure, those were separate arguments. The intentionality part was about contemporary, potential parents.
Lol having a planet that won't sustain us because we're actively murdering it is absolutely the silliest reason ever not to have kids. Go on, progeny! Enjoy your water wars and starvation! It would've been incredibly silly not to create you just so you could endure it.
