Suddenly seeing more hexbear posts. Did we re-federate with them?
Suddenly seeing more hexbear posts. Did we re-federate with them?
If so, was it polled somewhere?
So I was just looking through literature.cafe a bit, and came across this excellent comment chain by Janvier. It outlines the history and culture of Hexbear, and makes a very solid argument for defederating them.
TL;DR- Don't defederate Hexbear because they're a bunch of genocide-apologist authoritarians. Defederate them because they're annoying, and will burn out your moderators.
Personally I think it’s an extremely toxic community that represents the worst of the internet. They’re extremely set in their ways and provide no meaningful content or discussions on the platform. That’s totally fine for them but they can do whatever they want in their own safe space.
I would prefer them to be defederated mostly because I can’t block an entire instance.
I would prefer them to be defederated mostly because I can’t block an entire instance.
This is in development, fingers crossed it could even come in the next version of lemmy.
Report every hexbear comment and let the mods know how you feel. Should send the message.
I commented on here already about our instances interaction with hexbear. It's a disaster that led to somehow them defedarating from Blahaj for being not safe for their LGBT members even tho Blahaj is like one of the most accepting instance for LGBT people. Many of us were trying to ask our admin to defederate from them because those on our instance felt unsafe. Felt like a "no u" moment they tried to pull before we defederated them for not being safe for our members lol.
Then Blahaj started getting spammed by a new user who was calling a bunch of trans users anti trans. They also said our admins was anti trans even though she was openly trans. Then that user began spamming across lemmy how Blahaj and it's admin were anti-trans and should not be visited.
Also saw that user get a Blahaj user banned from lemmy.world even though nobody in that discussion was commenting on an lemmy.world community. It has a lot of shit so everything below is just that story.
What happened was another trans Blahaj user commented on a post on some 3rd instance and the OP of that post basically said "I know your reputation from elsewhere and your comment here proves your anti-trans reputation". The Blahaj user went wtf and then realized the OP was one of those commenting on the original trolls post and was basically saying the Blahaj user was anti trans. The Blahaj user was rightfully pissed and accused the OP of being an alt of that troll since they wrote in the same style as the original troll (I honestly was feeling the same as I read it all). The OP wouldn't reply and just stuff like " I refuse to reply to you" or "please don't talk to me" or "I respectfully ask you to not engage with me". It all felt trollish since that OP was the only who started the argument and now refused to engage after starting.
After the 3rd attempt at an reply , a lemmy.world admin came in saying that if the Blahaj user replied one more time to OP then they would be permanently banned from all of lemmy.world. Keep in mind this wasn't even on lemmy.world and the whole thing started because OP insulted a trans user by stating they were anti-trans. The Blahaj user was still pissed since she got insulted for saying she has the reputation of somebody who would hate everything she was and replied again. The original troll from way earlier came to the post & replied to her and tagged the lemmy.world admin saying they needed to be banned for being a chaser and replying after being told not to. Then the Blahaj user got banned.
It still feels so fucked that a lemmy.world admin would step into that 3rd instance and threaten the Blahaj user with loss of access to the biggest lemmy instance if she didn't ignore being called an anti-trans. It really helped show me the short comings of lemmy since every instances admin will probably just take what a user from their instance state as fact and ignore the other person.
Sorry for that long comment. It's just that I saw how hexbear will twist words in their favor like with claiming Blahaj isn't safe for their LGBT members and then strangely had new accounts show up calling trans Blahaj users as anti-trans and realized that it was just way too on the nose as where could these users have came from.
A bit misleading description of CTH on reddit, because they most certainly developed their obnoxious behaviour and jargon already back then, and they did very little to combat racism and fascism there precisely becuase their obnoxious behaviour was counter-productive to such goals (also there were other subreddits far more active and useful in combating fascism and bigotry on reddit such as r/againstallhatesubreddits, which did actual work on deplatforming fascists).
But other than that it is an apt description of their behaviour here and why they pose such a problem for lemmy in general.
Sucks for you guys. They caused nothing but trouble when they were still federated with Blahaj.
After so many of us complained about how they were being dicks and many on the instance weren't feeling comfortable, hexbear decided to defederate from us first since they somehow said it wasn't safe for their LGBT members to be on it.
Funny enough a few days later a new account started posting across different lemmy instances for days about how the Blahaj instance was anti trans and that the admin was too. Our Admin is openly trans :/
The whole argument started because the user said everything had to be political and wouldn't stop insulting others who said they didn't want to have every post on Blahaj to turn political.
It was just too perfect timing how a few days after hexbear defedarated for somehow saying the pro LGBT instance was anti-LGBT, that we got a brand new account attacking trans members while sayin they were anti-trans.
Enjoy your new people.
Isn't at leat one of the admins there trans? Basic fact checking, people.
Yeah the Blahaj admin they accused of being anti-trans was trans. They knew this too. The admin has talked to them in the original post that started it all and told the troll they were trans.
The user 100% did it on purpose to insult the Blahaj admin and to then go across all of Lemmy and post how they were anti trans.
I also saw that same user tag a Lemmy.world admin to tell them to ban a trans Blahaj user for being a chaser. Then the Blahaj user got banned even though nobody was commenting on a lemmy.world post. If you wanna read that long story then click this link to my other comment here. The 2nd half of my comment there is that long story.
seems like we will be defederated again soon judging by the vote in agora
Hey, you're talking about me! Yes, I was repeatedly misgendered by a user who claimed to be apolitical. Yes, I warned the admins that this user was going to be transphobic and they did nothing. Yes, I believe that trans people are capable of transphobia, because not every trans person knows every single thing in the universe about being trans.
I don't mind the general hexbear ideology in itself. Sure. You do you.
But, damn, I see more than a few of its members just being obnoxious.
It’d be lovely if you could just see the hexbear powerusers somewhere convenient and mass block. I went through a couple subreddits of theirs, found the top posts, blocked everyone with more than 50 upvotes. Real pain in the ass, but I suddenly have far fewer teenagers who peaked in middle school debate club to deal with.
Opinion of one of the admins regarding hexbear, just so you guys know where they stand:
In my view, the hexbear community is actually a positive force on this platform. They are frequently abrasive, but they ultimately have the potential to contribute to what we are building here. They are extremely active and some of them are quite intelligent. But they've also become accustomed to a privileged position on their own walled-in platform, and they need to be reminded that their views are considered ver extreme by the average person.
and some of them are quite intelligent.
some of them
I mean, I guess 1/1,000 can still be called some?
Which admin specifically please?
Weird, simply saying that trans people that are finished transitioning aren't trans... because they're done transitioning... as in they're now just a man or woman... got me called a bigot...
Like straight up, told that I'm a bigot and should not even think of speaking about trans people.
Some people over there also claimed that diseases didn't kill native Americans. They claimed it's "revisionist history" and they refered to the settlers as "shock troops".
I'm just glad these people probably don't go outside very much.
Lol I blocked the most annoying posters from hexbear on this thread and now there's hardly any comments. I think we should put them in time out. Like defederate for 15 days. if they keep brigading, another 15 days. I don't really want to defederate, but I hate this kind of brigading.
I'm going to follow your suit and fill up my block list. I can't take this anymore
No. They won't get better.
Defederate now permanently.
This is such bullshit. Just saw the announcement that we aren't going to defederate from hexbear. Why weren't we given a say in this?
The announcement didn't say that we weren't going to defederate. It said in the immediate future. If this proves to be untenable, we will have a vote.
Pretty disappointing that @iamaqtpie is active on hexbear and says things like:
Please direct any seething that you may wish to do to the struggle session that’s well underway over here.
which reddit considered hate speech 🙄
Also disappointing that hexbear gets to vote federation, while we are left to federate to hexbear without a choice because the admins like the instance. Lame.
It's clear that sh.itjust.works does not care to get community support in it's decision making and we are left at the whims of the admins preferences. Isn't this why most of us left Reddit? Because community say didn't mean anything?
LMAO I got banned for this post
No reason given. Just "mod Banned"
That's a highly suspicious use of a ban that I would like admin feedback on.
While your take about decision making is slightly wrong...
We're federating with everything by default and use blocklists. Hexbear is fedetating with nobody by default and uses allowlists.
Basically, no action has been made by local admins for this new federation to happen.
We never had to defederate them before because they weren't fedetating with us.The next step would be discussion then vote in the agora. I expect defederation to take a bit more than a week if the process hasn't changed too much since last time.
That said, your comment isn't anywhere near ban worthy and is a really bad optics on whichever mod was involved in that.
which reddit considered hate speech 🙄
here's the whole quote, emphasis mine:
Hexbear is a Lemmy server that was created about 3 years ago as a new home for the former users of r/chapotraphouse. CTH was banned from reddit because
they were openly calling for the deaths of slave owners, which reddit considered hate speech🙄Why would you take this out of context, and what is your issue with the whole quote?
The quote was to establish that the admins personal feelings are involved about the instance.
It is an objective fact that the sub was banned on Reddit for hate speech. The rolling eyes emoji establishes the admins personal feelings on the subject.
Whether the ban is justified or not is irrelevant to my point that SJW does not care to understand what its user base may want.
bad take, we are voting right now in agora about this. Are you ignorant of it or just shit stirring?
It’s clear that sh.itjust.works does not care to get community support in it’s decision making and we are left at the whims of the admins preferences. Isn’t this why most of us left Reddit? Because community say didn’t mean anything?
Make your own instance then, or move to another. That's the lemmy solution.
Lemmy isn't about having each instance be its own democracy, lemmy is about having lots and lots and lots of instances forming one massive network. These will always be privately owned by the people hosting them, so it's ultimately up to them how they run their shop. However, the barrier to entry is relatively low, so you can quite easily host your own and be on exactly the same footing.
If you want to talk about community, then that's literally what lemmy has instead of subreddits. That's where the users make the rules. Granted, there aren't sufficient mod tools to properly deal with anything - maybe when they introduce user-level instance blocking (coming soon ^TM ) they'll also give us community-level instance blocking.
They added us to their whitelist.
Thank you for being one of only two people in this thread that actually answered the question.
You're welcome. Most people were too busy complaining. Sync just added instance browsing and earlier I happened to be curious enough to check hexbear and saw the thread discussing it. Couldn't find it when I went back to look though.
They're abrasive enough that they couldn't even get along with lemmy.blahaj.zone, a dedicated LGBT friendly instance ran by several trans women, out of accusations of said admins being transphobic
Also can't forget them getting offended over /c/196 because they have a "no tankies" rule, which apparently is a slur for them
196 is by far the main community on blåhaj, and their banner basically says "no hexbears."
Also, trans hexbear users gave examples where they were bothered by chasers in 196, and felt not enough mod action was taken to control chasers there. I'm sympathetic to Ada, blåhaj's admin, I think she really means well and I get that she might not want to rock the boat when the community in question is most of her site. But I don't think hexbear's reasons for defederating are that absurd.
That tracks.
Is the embedded images in posts a hexbear thing or a generational thing? It's kinda gross.
What the actual fuck is wrong with admins of SJW?
Please direct any seething that you may wish to do to the struggle session that's well underway over here.
Thought this instance puts things to vote so yeah, duck you too, goodbye.
Yeah, garbage post. I expect we'll see discussion/vote for defederation soon, though. I'd like to hear from TheDude as his stance made a lot more sense when we were defederating from exploding-heads.
Discussion thread is ongoing as we speak.
But more seriously, this wasn't a vote for us to have. We hadn't actually defederated from them in the first place. Their instance is one of the few set to whitelist only. Instead of federating with everyone by default and defederating by adding URLs to a blacklist, they exclusively select instances to federate with by their admins manually adding them to their allow list.
So it was their instance that decided to add us to their list of instances they'll interact with. No change was made at sh.itjust.works without local user consultation. If you have concerns with this there is a recent discussion post at the [email protected]
OK, first time I've seen the dread Hexbear brigading in action. So, thanks, I guess?
Now I understand why they warrant defederation. I'm glad on on a Lemmy instance that defederated them, and suppose I'l have to find a kbin instance that does as well (apparently this one doesn't defederate them if I'm reading this correctly?)
The irony is that, although I've been in the fediverse a while, today I literally made my first kbin account.
This post was created by someone from the sh.itjust.works instance.
Do a CTRL+F search for Hexbear Accounts, if you can't find any, your instance is defederated from them
What the hell is hexbear? This is like the 3rd time I've seen it mentioned today
Rowdy and very active left-leaning instance which recently rejoined the rest of lemmy. They tend to be very vocal in calling out racism, sexism, homophobia and other forms of bigotry, which has made certain users very angry. On the other hand, some of them seem to be very tolerant of certain authoritarian countries, which makes a certain other group of users very uncomfortable.
They tend to be very vocal in calling out racism, sexism, homophobia and other forms of bigotry
To me it seems more like creative interpretation of everything as those things if it doesn't fit with their groupthink. It's not "calling out" if they're abusing it as a general purpose weapon, that's just bullying.
It's where the far right go to play dress up as LGBT and call everyone else a nazi/be ruzzian apologists and blame the failings of the communist ecosphere on white western liberals.
It's basically the opposite of a sincere environment.
Yes it should be renamed to ConcernTrolling101
My big comment debunking yours is gone and there's nothing in the modlog, what the hell? It's even gone from my comment history. It had votes, it was definitely successfully posted and appeared for a while
*Found it in the lemmy.world modlog, which makes no sense, because I am not a lemmy.world user and this is not a lemmy.world thread, so they shouldn't have the ability to remove a comment from my comment history
I happened to still have it open in a tab I never refreshed, here's what it said:
I realize this won't matter, because you have a mental wall up against recognizing that anyone might have reasons to attack your beliefs from the left, but
5 day old thread where all of hexbear agrees they hate trump
older thread where all of hexbear celebrates trump getting covid
old thread where all of hexbear celebrates Rush Limbaugh's death
I'm basically picking threads at random because the entire site is full of posts and comments expressing the direst hatred for right-wingers and fascists.
Some of the top comments from the first link:
https://hexbear.net/comment/3839449
I would say 100% of Hexbear posters believe Trump should be immediately summarily executed. In the mean time, though, he's a great comedic subject.
========
https://hexbear.net/comment/3843515
None of us support Trump, just as none of us support Putin. But there is a sort of overcompensation in reaction to naieve and simplistic liberal narratives that might make it seem like we do.
Leftists get frustrated with the worldview that imagines, to steal a phrase, that Trump is Voldemort and Biden is Harry Potter. Anti-capitalists oppose the Bourgeoisie and Trump and Biden are both in service to them. It isn’t even simply that they are both capitalists - they are both neoliberals, who enthusiastically pursue the goals of neoliberalism - the transfer of wealth and power from the working class to the bourgeoisie, the enforcement of Western imperialism on a global scale, the withering away of society through austerity and privatisation, etc.
Of course it’s fine to support the democrats with the aim of harm minimisation. But liberals are wilfully blind to the fact that the system itself is not ‘rotten’ but rather functioning as intended, and that the scale of change required to have any hope of addressing climate change, wealth inequality, the descent into fascism and so on, cannot come from within liberal ideology at all let alone from the democrat party. Trump is kind of funny too in the way that he infuriates liberals by openly unveiling reality. For example, no-one cared when Obama was putting children in concentration camps, because it was hidden away behind a bunch of shiny rhetoric about hope and change. But when Trump does the same thing and celebrates it, when he brings the racism and inhumanity of the US state into the light and declares fuck those kids, liberals are forced to see the true nature of their beloved country which their ideological fantasies would usually repress. The blatant hypocrisy of their rage is, from the perspective of cynical leftists, both amusing and bewildering.
========
https://hexbear.net/comment/3840542
This will echo what others have said: I think Trump was a horrible president, and him being of the capitalist class means I oppose him in a political economy sense. However, the stuff that he did that was bad was bog standard Republican shit: any other Republican would have also cut taxes, deregulated industry, and installed far right whack job judges. And I also think Democrats have done horrible shit; better/worse comparisons are mostly useless as they brush over specifics.
However, I do think he’s fascinating, both in that he may be the perfect reflection of the American political body, and because he highlights fundamental contradictions in nominal American liberal and conservative politics that causes both his detractors and supporters to be extremely neurotic about him. He represents what liberals profess to be the ideal (coastal, urban, private school educated, Ivy League grad, made his money in NYC real estate; shit, any big money Dem donor clicks at least three of those boxes), and what conservatives profess to hate (urban, non-religious, elitist, arrogance), yet the former hate him and the latter love him.
For liberals, it’s that he exposes the lie that elite education credentials stewed in urban culture must always produce socially progressive and competent technocrats, which is why they steadfastly insist he’s some Manchurian Candidate Russian plant because they need to see him as an abnormality and not reflective of the gross underbelly of the meritocracy. For conservatives, he exposes that for all their rhetoric they really love the idea of elites and hierarchy and being lessers to the titans of industry and the state. They just don’t want those titans to be brown, Jewish, or female. So they need to built a weird, cultish mythology around him as an ubermensch, anti-elite elite as to keep up the illusion of them being against hierarchy. All this neurosis is both highly illuminating, and really fucking funny.
Is there a straightforward way to go through and block all communities on hexbear? I browse All but would like to avoid accidentally commenting on any of their posts.
Sync can do it
Filter comment and posts from the entire instance.
It's great.
Connect too. They were the first in fact iirc
Not yet, but lemmy should have user controls to block instances soon
I thought my instance defederated with them, but I just realized I blocked like a dozen or so of them and now they're non existent on here lol.
That's the way to do it.
Calling this present thread a "struggle session" is dismissive at best if not downright insulting and I expect better from our mod team.
What's insulting about "struggle session"? I will concede that it was dismissive, because I was dismissing demands for immediate defederation, which contradicts our decision making process.
Ehhh... I'll try to assume the best here and just quote what Wikipedia has to say on struggle sessions.
If you read that and still think that's an apt choice of words, then... idk? yikes?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struggle_session
Struggle sessions or denunciation rallies were violent public spectacles in Maoist China where people accused of being "class enemies" were publicly humiliated, accused, beaten and tortured by people with whom they were close. Usually conducted at the workplace, classrooms and auditoriums, "students were pitted against their teachers, friends and spouses were pressured to betray one another, [and] children were manipulated into exposing their parents". Staging, scripts and agitators were prearranged by the Maoists to incite crowd support. The aim was to instill a crusading spirit among the crowd to promote the Maoist thought reform. These rallies were most popular in the mass campaigns immediately before and after the establishment of the People's Republic of China and during the Cultural Revolution.
Regardless of where one stands on this particular topic, I don't think this is a term we should ever want associated with anything, let alone our vote discussion threads?
The discussion should be an integral part of the vote and decision making process and to me, dismissing it or shitting on in kinda stinks up the whole thing.
Dismissal, and implying the discussion is a sham, coming from someone in a position of power... I mean yea, that's kind of insulting? — not to me, but to the ideals of this place and the agora.I can't really know your intent, and while I prefer to assume the best, it's not really a good look.
I appear to be out of the loop. What's wrong with hexbear? I'm not familiar with the instance.
They're just an annoying bunch of wannabe communists who sound incredibly smug and post a ton of stickers in comments. Having said that I've moved to lemm.ee when lemmy.world defeterated from hexbear.
Lots of tankies from what I'm seeing, they're the "alt-left" if you will, they believe in just as much weird stuff as the alt-right but are on the left side of the spectrum... Heck they end up meeting on many things...
If you're familiar with CTH and the dirtbag left, Hexbear is where they went after being banned by Reddit.
For what it is when lemm.ee considered de-federated from them they flooded the instance turning a 200 comment thread into 1200. And lots of harassment. Edit: In case you wanted to read that clusterbomb of a thread: https://lemm.ee/post/4543536
I had to look them up but yep I do remember CTH. Thanks for the answer, I'll keep an eye out.
I had some conversations here. They were saying that north Korea is a lovely democracy, Russia is totally justified in Ukraine, and China isn't doing anything to the Uyghurs in Xinjiang. Just some examples from yesterday.
I just like to watch the drama from here on lemmy.ml 🍿
I'm on world and I've only ever seen comments around the hexbear drama. But now I get to see the users in this thread and oh. my. god. This is hilarious.
It's funny at first, then it eventually gets annoying, then it starts to get confusing after you block most of them.
I wouldn't mind their viewpoints if they weren't basically all in bad faith or just a whatabboutism. It gets really old to just see "Well some western country did X at one point in time, so none of what you said matters" over and over again. It's not like they even continue on to discuss their whatabboutism example, they just move on and derail the next thread they see where they can insert another whatabboutism.
Right? This shit is fun lol !
I think this is a great example of how federation allows you to make an account somewhere else....
Just make an account in an instance that defederated hexbear. Even if an admin is an idiot they'll know to take action if the user count begins to stagnate or fall.
Honestly just chat/interact with them. What's the big deal? They seem humorous. Or just block their communities
