For complete fairness to everyone we should tax every vehicle on road or path from scooters and bikes to b-doubles based on the 4th power of axle load to properly account for the impact on road maintenance costs. Then additional levies for disproportionate environmental costs and harm to vulnerable road users. Keep the overall tax amount the same but shift the burden so people with smaller vehicles pay substantially less than they do now. And then add strict liability for anything much larger than a kei car.
Since the amount of damage caused by bikes to infrastructure would be small, the govt could just slap a tax for the cost to the purchase price of every bike. Not saying I'd agree with it but there are ways to make all road users pay their share.
They’re every inconvenience rolled in to one. A pain to get in. A pain to park. Use heaps of fuel. Don’t fit in garages, and to top it off are expensive AF. I’m confident in saying unless you tow like, horse floats on the regular, if you own one you’re a fucking idiot.
They're also way more dangerous. They do more damage if they hit something, and because of the terrible visibility they're more likely to hit something.
That said, if they do hit something, the people inside the tank might be ok.
They are more likely to roll than normal cars (SUVs excluded), and when they roll they're generally more likely to crush the roof due to their weight. So yeah, while they're better off than the car they hit, they're still not amazing safety wise.
They're not actually that bad on fuel. Don't get me wrong, I'd never own one but a few of our major players at work have them as some sort of status symbol. Cruising in overdrive at 100km/h they can go as low as 6L/100km, but average is around 12L/100km unless you are doing lots of hunting through the gearbox or driving like a dick, then you can see some truly disturbing fuel usage figures.
To put it in perspective, this is on par with a modern hilux, and WORLDS better than the 2022 79 series landcruiser even with all the fuel efficiency gains they made.
To be clear I still don't think anyone should be driving one here - our roads and car parks are simply not built for them. They aren't that great offroad either. Really the only genuine use case is towing an enormous caravan down the hwy, in which case I hate you anyway because that's TWO symbols of you being an inconsiderate prick that doesn't care about anyone else.
Pain to get in? The hell are you talking about. It's much easier getting in and out of a truck than a normal car with the seat a feet from the ground. Especially for tall/old people.
Depends which truck I guess. I've been in a couple that were so big that the step up was uncomfortable, and I'm 6'3 so that just shouldn't ever happen.
Why do people even like inefficient, huge cars if they're not going to use most of its features, not even in the foreseeable future? Such a bloated design for an everyday car, and even more potentially dangerous at that... those Japanese cars have a more elegant and sleek design, as well as efficient. Well, I would like good public transportation too.
In America they are mostly bought because of consumerism and fragile masculinity.
Where I live trucks are at around half the vehicles. My wife and I play a game where we try to spot a truck hauling something that they actually needed the truck for. Most trips I'll see dozens of trucks and zero being necessary.
Do you see them on the weekends when they're hauling their 4 wheelers, boats, or motorcycles? You probably don't make it to the outdoors much, but there's good reasons to have a pickup.
They’re perfect for running over children and claiming complete ignorance of the child. It’s so bad that they’re thinking of installing front facing cameras on these things.
These are showing up all over the place in The Netherlands, a country that is not built to accommodate these Emotional Support Trucks. Most are bought by business owners who would be served far better by vans. Even a small van has more usable cargo space than these behemoths, and will actually fit in parking spaces, but for some stupid reason these can be had for cheap by companies because of tax rules (that’s what 20 years of right-wing government does for you). It really is beyond infuriating.
In America, I’m sick and tired of seeing them. They’re minivans for insecure dads. They’re props for office workers who want to LARP as construction workers
Every time I see them, all I can think is that they hate kids (huge blind spots) and love to complain about gas/petrol prices. They also don’t fit in our huge parking spaces. Sure, they have their uses, but I really doubt that the shiny, pristine truck is being used to haul/tow anything
The real construction workers/laborers are usually seen driving normal sedans/cars, minivans, or actual vans. Fuck pickup trucks, they’re awful
I disagree with that. A minivan has a clear and specific function it does rather well (moving a lot of people comfortably, and having a lot of space). These things don't, really. The cab takes up so much space the bed is close to vestigial, and the only thing it's really good for is towing.
You can carry more with the minivan, compared to the pickup (just put the wood inside the minivan) and some of them even have all-wheel drive. You won't be fording streams and climbing mountains with it, as fun as that might look, so that's probably fine too.
I saw an image comparing these with the older versions, and while the size of the vehicle has massively increased, the size of the actual tray has decreased.
Hey! Don't judge them too harshly for admitting they need an Emotional Support Vehicle for their fragile ego, there's a reason they need such obvious over-compensateors. /s
I'm honestly always weary of these kinds of vehicles, the blind-spots are freaking massive. they are also much more difficult to see "around" to try and get a sense of what traffic/etc is like further ahead/around you.
They have to be - safety standards require vehicles to not kill everyone inside if you roll it, which means the roof needs to be able to support the entire weight of the vehicle.
As I understand it is because of emission control laws.
It is hard for manufacturers to create cars which fallow regulations and those big trucks are exempt from regulations since they are "trucks" and not "cars".
I wonder how can those even be legal, I am seeing the lm more and more in Europe and it is so sad since they are bigger than most streets.
My dad recently bought an F-350. He works in an office and lives in the suburbs. Why he willing chose to get 14mpg with post COVID gas prices is beyond me...
The F150 isn't even the worst offender, I'm sitting in my office looking out the window and there is a lifted wankerado in the carpark. it's hood is up to my shoulders and I'm 5'11. They're not a good off roader why lift them like that?
How the fuck is that even legal.
I used to drive an ND MX5, and when one of these cunt-mobiles was behind me I always tried to get off the line as fast as that little thing would let me because I was certain some the drivers had no idea I was there.
I drive a nc mx5, another issue is that their headlights (which are always bright white and far too bright even on low beams) shine directly into my side mirrors (and often the rear view as well) due to the height at which they are placed. Also, they are often are too close when high beams turn on automatically, which presents further problems for road awareness.
These mofo americans are ruining it for everyone. I have stopped watching hollywood movies as they tend to show these cars and most regulars get brain washed and start buying this shit.
I would love to go electric, but I can't afford an eutectic car and I live in an apartment with no chatting stations.
On top of that, I still have misgivings due to the longevity of current battery technology. Current Li-ion batteries have a pretty strict life span. Combine that with the fact that I will probably never be able to afford a new car meaning any car I do own in going to be running on an already old battery box and replacing the battery box is very expensive. Also most electric vehicles are artificially rendered unrepairable by the user, requiring "licensed repair technicians" to repair them, at a premium price of course. It's just not in the cards for poor people. Not to mention the environmental and humanitarian impact of li-ion battery manufacturing.
Electric vehicles could be part of the solution to our environmental problems, but capitalism is crippling then at their knees.
For what it's worth, here's my anacdotal experience.
I traded in a Hybrid Camry for a Hyundai Ionic Electric almost exactly 3 years ago.
The Electric version was $40k (it was a demo so about $5k cheaper than brand new) and about $8-10k more than the petrol only model.
The first year of driving it I saved a minimum of $4k in petrol compared to the old hybrid and that is with the electricity costs factored in. Though it was closer to 4.5 when solar was taken into consideration.
This year I saved a bit more due to higher petrol prices and was a minimum of $5k saved compared to the hybrid, and again closer to 5.5 with solar.
Both years I did about 25,000kms. So after 2 years the difference in price has paid for itself, though we still have a loan for the car in theory the extra savings from not paying for petrol will help to pay the rest of the loan off. Though it's mostly being eaten up by inflation.
We are lucky enough to be in a position of semi- owning our own home so we could install power in the carport and solar. If we were renting we certainly wouldn't have done that which makes a huge difference. Also if we couldn't charge at home it'd be a massive hassle to charge away from home, which I've only had to do 5-6 times in the last 2 years. We only have a travel charger at home it is 2.2kw and very slow but we don't, and haven't needed a faster charger.
For battery life, my car has I think, an 8 year warranty on the battery having at least 90% capacity remaining. My range is typically 330kms on a full charge. If I get down to 90% capacity and still have 300kms off a charge I won't notice the difference.
I worked out the rough difference of my car compared to the petrol in terms of carbon emissions from making the battery just using global averages for making batteries. My car hit even with the petrol at about 70,000kms, after that it significantly drops off on the carbon emission side even when using 100% grid power from only coal power while petrol cars keep producing.
For the global average driver at 10,000kms a year it's obviously about 7 years to break even, for myself it'll be the end of year 3 in theory.
I can't say much on replacing batteries even though currently it is very expensive, battery technology and capacity keeps getting better, so one would hope that would mean in the future it would cost less to replace and give you more range. But then how will the shareholders reap the benefits of record profits every year.
I never really did the serving on my hybrid, but I've found the service costs pretty comparable. The last 12 month service was $360 and that includes 22months of roadside assistance.
I want to also mention it is the smoothest car I've ever driven which is nice on long trips.
I know there'll be people who will not care about any of this and others will still consider electric cars bad because of {insert small inconvenience or difference to petrol cars}, but don't let perfect be the enemy of good. They're a good start for individuals to make the change if they have the means, but the largest corporations are the biggest polluters which need regulations and rules put in place before they will start doing there share.
Lifespan is not really a huge issue. You might lose 5-10% of the battery after 100k miles. Tesla's degradation after 200k miles is 12%. There is much less maintenance that needs to be done on them overall. It is indeed a larger cost up front but even with our cheap gas here in the US, it can pay for itself after 6 or 7 years.
But you are correct that access to them for poorer people. We do need to make a push to at least get level 1 chargers in apartment garages.
As far as environmental impact, cobalt is the worst of it but that is being passed out. Lithium mining is done where there is no life at all. A large chunk of the lithium in our batteries is from the Atacama Desert which has large portions that have no recorded instances of rain. Regardless, it is still significantly better than using fossil fuels in internal combustion engine.
I don't understand why they're suddenly getting traction here. These big utes have been around forever but it just feels like you see them all the time now.
I live in a state where everyone drives the Diesel version of these. Diesel engines are loud and smelly. I just want to yell at everyone of them.
"Thanks ED, for purchasing an Earth killing monstrosity. You're not even hauling anything with that over priced, micro-penis replacement. Maybe you should get a bigger one so you can put more gun racks in it ED!"
They should be allowed to drive them, but pay a price for them. Tax the absolute shit out them and don't allow it to be a taxable right off for "business purposes". But then I also say that should go for all four wheel drivers. 30 years ago the only people who had anything bigger than a station wagon were people that actually used them for recreational use. The argument of "it's safer for me to drive them" is the same argument people use when the gun debate is used - it's only safer because everyone else has one is not a valid argument.
People don't need four wheel drives - they have them because it's convenient. If you want that convenience then you should have to pay for it.
taxing them wont remove their massive blind spots that make them so dangerous. Even fwds have some use cases but these don't, to my knowledge there isn't any thing these stupid things can do that another vehicle cant do better besides maybe running over children, no one needs one of these.
Honestly. Starting to see these in the UK too, and all I can think is who the hell needs one of these things??
I can't imagine they're easy to drive around or park given their size, and they must guzzle through petrol. Even if you had a big family, surely you'd just get an SUV with not totally exposed to the elements boot space.
Tbh, I would get an electric one. They're handy for moving larger items. It's not done often, but there are moments where I wish I had enough space to, move a desk or a TV for example. That's why one of my friends keeps an ancient minivan alongside his new EV crossover.
Unless you already have one, for the sake of all the costs you'd need to pay to have a second car, I feel like you'd be better off just hiring a small van or something for a few hours when you need it rather than shelling out on a massive pickup.
They are currently writing disgusting comments under 19 y.o. models status updates with their public facebook profile with pictures of their divorced wifes.
I think they certainly have their use cases for people with goosenecks and large boats, but there is no way that many people have a gooseneck and/or large boat
Unless you're doing that every single week, you're still better off getting a more sensible car for your day-to-day use and renting something more powerful when you need that power.
Oh yeah and with Equestrian if you're buying one of these for a horse float it is certainly a status symbol. You are better off with a dedicated truck for that, since you can get them a lot cheaper second hand and purchase a more practical car for day to day stuff
Bought my first pickup a few years back and it's by far the most fun vehicle I've ever owned. Hard to imagine ever going back to a normal car.
I use it to haul construction material quite regurlarly so it's just not for fun too. It's a real pickup too and not one of those with a cab longer than the bed. Seats two people.
I call them 3 and a half tonne child killers. These and Range Rover, Q7s X5s etc.
What I find totally ironic is the arseholes who drive these things park at the shops then bring out their hemp shopping bags. ‘Yeah let’s protect our environment’ fucking hypocrites.
These things are so incredibly ugly on top of everything else that's wrong with them. Thanks for all the brilliant names in this thread though, wankerado is my favourite so far.
They are both better at different types of off road environments. The raptor was designed as a Baja racer, referring to the Baja 1000, a very punishing desert race. If I was crawling through the jungle I'd rather have a land cruiser.
Oh man, those raptors look so amazing for off road. There is a Grand Tour where Hammond drves it through the Candian Rockies. Way too much money for me, but super awesome truck for the back country.
Maybe it makes me a bad person but I'd love one, even just for a few years.
I ride 20km to uni each way, eat less than 1 meat meal a week on average and am highly interested in solar/renewable energies but fuck me I'd love a big truck... specifically one bigger than everyone elses.
They do appeal to some carnal desire ngl. I wanted a Cybertruck when it was first announced just because it was big and garish (and I didn't yet know Elon that sucks). Thank god it's taking so long to come out or I might have actually bought one.
If you live in the City then these things are pointless, but in the country they are some of the handy vehicles to have. And they sell like hotcakes out here.
I live in bumfuck Egypt and mostly everybody drives a truck. They are awful, giant, and dangerous. I do not feel that the majority of people that use them actually need them, but everybody has bought into the marketing campaign that in order to be a real man you gotta drive some big fuckoff vehicle. It'sd asinine
I do see a use case for them in Egypt though. In harsher environments they excel quite well. They're designed to be more reliable and serviceable than regular cars. But it's unnecessary in urban environments and easier climates.