I don't know what you millenial z's or something keep complaining about - just buy a detached single family house with a backyard in the city for 125k and pay up your 1% interest rate mortgage within 10 years while your wife keeps it clean and drinks herself to death while resenting you daily, like any civilized 30 year old with a job for life and guaranteed payout pension does!
Is the /s really necessary?
Man. Every time I see it again spelled out, how smooth these disingenuous decrepit assholes had it when they were my age, I start wishing for a claymore and a stump.
Is the /s really necessary?
Depending on the age range, someone might think you are being serious. I'd just leave it.
Look at these fucking comments around us, it's clearly neccesary.
If someone thinks you are serious this would prove the dystopian reality even more haha
Landlords out here in lemmy dot marxist lenninists comments deadass pretending their right to steal wealth is more important than ones fundamental human right to housing.
Let this be your reminder that "Landlords" do nothing of value. Anytime they claim they are, they are doing the work of an occupation that possibly does, like an electrician or developer or architect or carpenter or handyman or painter or realtor. Ticket scalpers don't create tickets. Don't let these antisocial freaks rewrite the dictionary, or excuse their own refusal to read anything about their own behavior.
If they try to cosplay as a pitiable person who only owns a house and doesn't want to be broke, tell them that their victims don't want that either, and only the landlord hates working for a living more than they hate parasitizing the wealth others. Their "ethical and reasonable" rent seeking is enabled by the threat of violence from the other "unreasonable" rent seekers, therefore acting as a single unified class.
They could have sold their houses to profit, but that's not enough for them. They must do their part to squeeze every drop of blood from that soil so that they don't accidentally decomodify housing even slightly by providing their smidge of housing to the captive market.
Read On The Rent of the Land. Fuckers.
Sir, this is a meme community
Paying a bank hundreds of thousands of dollars in interest is also robbery. what did the bank do? Were rich and did paperwork. Wow so irreplaceable and valuable. Think of all the poor people they swindled to get there! Amazing 😍
The bank isnt even that rich... They are allowed to just dream up the money from nothing and lend it to you.
And if you miss a payment, they get to reposses a real asset.
This is the biggest scam in history. The bank lends you imaginary money, and then reposesses a real asset
Disclaimer: not advocating for current system.
What alternative would you propose for providing loans?
My controversial (for Lemmy) take is that loans are good for society. They provide an incentive to not hoard resources, but provide them to those who want to put them into action today for future benefit.
A good loan benefits both parties, ie. An auto loan that allows someone to buy a car to get to a job to earn an income that is above the cost of the loan. Without the loan that person couldn't get to work and whatever service they were providing to society is lost.
All that said - that doesn't mean the way loans work today is the best solution, but the same functionality of trading current and future resources needs to exist. You don't have to call it a loan, and it doesn't have to be performed by private for profit institutions, but if you want a thriving economy I believe you need this function carried out somehow.
The equivalent function in Communism is (or historically has been) a centrally planned resource allocation which very clearly is a horrible idea because of the incentives towards corruption. If you take a literal interpretation of communism (instead of historical) where "the workers own the means of production" trade unions could fulfill this current to future resource allocation function. I do not know if this would create the same corruption as single central authority, but my gut feels is that it would (based on the US labor union and organized crime affiliation of the past.
In short, the current function for trading current and future resources (ie. loans) is far from ideal, but I have not found an alternate that provides more benefits than deficits. I would love to learn about more alternatives, but just saying 'loans R bad' makes it sound like you're advocating getting rid of them with nothing to handle their underlying function, which is a terrible idea.
I agree with you. And yeah it's bizarre that loans are literally just a privilege that banks get...to create new money out of thin fucking air. I agree--Biggest scam in history.
But Isn't that how all business works?
Customers pay for things and that payment pays to keep the business going.
Something Something housing should be a right not a business
The business in this case being what? What good or service is being provided? Landlords didn't create the land, nor did they build the residence, nor did they improve its value by building a community around it. They are benefiting off of the work of others simply because they "own" it. The most common arguments I hear in support of landlords are:
- Landlords take care of maintenance. Maintenance costs don't increase 20% a year. If rent was simply maintenance costs it would be a fraction of what it currently is
- Landlords allow people who cannot afford a home a place to stay. Why do you think they can't afford a home? It's like saying without scalpers people wouldn't be able to see concerts because the tickets are instantly purchased by bots.
Landlords take on risk. For example, when I rented an apartment, I came home one day to a plumbing disaster. I called emergency maintenance and left. The landlord fixed it and paid for my hotel in the meantime. As a home owner now, that would be entirely on me to figure out. I'm pretty handy, but I have no disrespect for someone who doesn't want to be responsible for that.
More importantly, selling a house costs about 10% of the value of the house, and the first few years of a mortgage you're mostly paying interest. If you move every 3 years, it's actually cheaper to rent than to buy. It's just that your money is going to a landlord instead of to banks and realtors.
So while I see your argument that landlords don't "deserve" the money they make, practically they're an important part of the housing market, and I respect people who make an informed decision to rent.
The two big main ones I can think of.
They provide short term housing. If your only planning to say 1-2 years in a location it often doesn't make much sense to buy a house.
They also take on all of risk of the property.
Obviously I am not saying landlords are the greatest thing in the world but they do serve a purpose.
Some people don't want to be locked down to one place for long. When I was in my twenties I moved to a different town every year when my lease was up just to see if I would like it better somewhere else. Or I'd get a raise and be able to afford a better place the next year. For people that want relatively short term housing, renting is a far superior option.
If I took out a mortgage on a place and then sold it a year later, I'd have almost no equity since you pay almost all interest in the front part of the loan.
Is this post saying that if the landlord CAN afford the house without you paying rent, then it's justified, and in that case they ARE providing you housing?
In the same way GPU and game console scalpers were generously, out of the goodness of their heart providing GPUs and game consoles to the masses.
Thank the lord for scalpers, honestly. Glad they were able to help some people get their stuff!
Thanks for reminding me to pay rent today :/
Although I agree with the sentiment - I am curious how the system works with landlords having so many unoccupied units in some cities. Especially business/commercial/industrial landlords. It keeps rent artificially high, while reducing some types of overhead I would guess.
Speculation. Some investors are more interested in holding the property until they can sell it in the future for a profit, rather than the rent they would earn now. Some landlords will have negative cashflow even if they are charging rent because they know they can sell the property for a profit later.
So if the housing market crashed like really bad, by say everybody owning multiple homes being suddenly unable to afford the loans for that many homes, what would happen?
The banks would have to repossess the properties. And sell them on the market, but with many homes to sell, the price would come down crashing.
One can dream.
That is precisely how we have wound up in the current market.
housing are people to live in. shouldn't be used for speculation. a landlord in my building owns like 7 or 8 apartments. insanely hight rent prices. this should be fucking ilegal. greed destroying society
Rent is robbery... But your landlord is poorer than you? What?
People with diverse skills or able to remote work, move to the Midwest and rural mountain states. Swing them blue and get all the mcmansions you want.
No one said that landlord's are poor, landlord's quite literally leech off of their tenants pay checks, making them even richer than they were to start, without lifting a finger, or contributing anything to society.
Can you do the duck one pleeese?
Assume that you intend to live in said house indefinitely, we are comparing two options:
- You taking a loan to buy a house, which upon full payment you own the house.
- A landlord takes a loan to buy a house, you (and other tenants) pay off said loan, then landlord owns the house.
In both cases you are paying off a loan and incurring risk of increasing interest rates, but in one you end up owning your home, in the other you end up owning nothing.
At face value the effort put by the tenant is the same, but the reward is disproportionate, which is why one is a robbery and the other is not.
I am not against the idea of renting out property, or earning money as a landlord. But this arrangement is unfair. To help rectify this imbalance I propose, in the case of rental contracts, move the risk of the loan from the tenant to the landlord. What? How? You might ask. By controlling the rent, and not allowing it beyond a reasonable threshold. The rent may not depend on:
- Increasing interest rates.
- Perceived inflation (Oh my God, Ukraine, Coronavirus, we need to rake up the rent fast fast fast... you get my point).
But it can depend on other factors, such as provable unforeseen maintenance costs or officially reported inflation rates.
tl;dr If you want to become a landlord by taking a loan, you have to incur the risk yourself, otherwise you are being unfair to long-term tenants.
First, I've had a lot of evil landlords, so I understand the animosity. However, as a landlord who owns two houses that I rent to my friends, let me risk getting downvoted to hell to explain the value that I add, and the reason why both friends prefer this arrangement despite my offering to sell them the properties they live in.
You say the effort is the same, but it's not true. Here are some of the things I do that take either the physical or mental load of home ownership off my tenants:
- escrow and pay property taxes on time
- shop around for the best insurance and make sure the property is covered with not only homeowner's insurance but also flood insurance
- perform various regular maintenance tasks like pesticide application, HVAC checkups twice a year, inspection and repair of any damage reported to me
- perform emergency repairs or call in workers when things break, being available during the day when the contractors come - or replace broken appliances, etc.
- shop around and pay for utilities
- landscaping and lawn maintenance
My best friend is one of my tenants. She has severe ADHD and lost a home once before due to her inability to save money for the inevitable repairs and unexpected expenses, plus not staying on top of needed maintenance and repairs. This arrangement where I take care of all the details and she just pays monthly rent is a win-win. My other tenant is my handyman who literally begged me to rent a townhome that I was planning to sell. He didn't want to buy it because his credit isn't that great and he wasn't planning on being there more than about five years. I charge both of them a really fair rate that just covers my expenses.
So yes, at the end of the day, they own nothing. But they are not getting nothing for their money. They're getting comfortable, well maintained shelter and peace of mind.
It's interesting to hear from the other side and thank you for the reply. I can acknowledge that what you are saying is true. The peace of mind of not having to deal with said responsibilities, has a value and therefore a cost. Tenants also have the freedom to move out whenever they want.
However, grievances arise when:
- Landlord overcharges.
- Landlord doesn't take their responsibilities and leaves their property to deteriorate with paying tenants (read: human beings) still in them. It doesn't help when said landlord owns a nice villa and a couple of boats.
- Tenant stays in one apartment for 30 years, realizing they have been given the short end of the stick. The issue is further exacerbated when combined with point #1 or #2.
It's a mix. There are people out there with genuine grievances, while at the same time others are very happy with renting their current apartments. I've seen both, personally.
ITT: No one understands the benefits of renting over owning a home.
Well in theory it makes you more mobile (if you want/need to move for some reason): just give your landlord notice and move out. Whereas selling can take an indefinite amount of time.
Yeah, not to mention the responsibilities that a landlord has when it comes to maintenance on the property. I was saying no one else in this thread gets that there are benefits to renting, even though there are.
Everyone paints landlords as money grubbing evil people. I own a couple rental houses and set prices so that my return is 7% annually. While that may paint me as the description above realize this; that price was set when I set a tenant and only increases with inflation. The majority of my units are 25% below market rates because once I have a good tenant I don't see a reason to make more work for me. 7% return and I never hear from them is worth it in my mind.
that price [...] increases with inflation
While the vast majority of wages don't, not nearly enough to keep with inflation. Surely you can see the problem here, right? I agree with op that you should get a real job.
But yeah, putting the blame on individual landlords isn't very productive. The core issue here is the capitalist system that allows landlords to exist in the first place.
Lemmy can be such a hateful place sometimes. Mom and Pop landlords such as yourself are not the problem. I would assume that most people renting from you are not in a situation where they can buy a house yet. Providing them a place at a reasonable price gives them the opportunity to save for a house of their own. I think just about everybody who has bought a house had to rent first, including myself, without available rentals what would we do?
The only issue I have is with the types that rent part of their house at a price that's well above their mortgage payments. I hate that everyone just shrugs and says "the market has spoken! Some website said I could get 2k for a studio basement apartment so that's the price!"
I can't say I like people buying multiple houses and then renting them so there is less for everyone who wants to buy, but I can be somewhat sympathetic to the idea that there really are people who just want to rent a house for a handful of years and then move on so in that case it really is a service.
My last landlord charged 1200 for a basement... His mortgage was less than $900... Yeah yeah taxes and whatnot, but the point remains that I should not be paying all of your expenses for the "luxury" of renting a basement...
Our individualistic culture makes people incapable of seeing the problem systemically, and instead they cry when they feel like a critique of the system feels like a personal assault of an individual's character.
It's not fucking about landlords 'being decent people', it's about a system that profits from the systemic disenfranchisement of the working class.
In the same way 'all cops are bastards' because the profession is built around protecting the capitalist class by oppressing the working class, 'all landlords are bastards' too.
There are very few jobs that actually give annual raises that keep up with inflation. You are no better than corporations that raise the price of food for no reason, other than following an arbitrary market metric(inflation) You should give your tenants 3 months free rent for Christmas, and give them the option to buy the properties from you for what you bought them for, and get a real job.
What part of 25% below market makes you compare him to the food oligopoly? He likes trouble-free tenants, and I'm pretty sure his tenants like this arrangement too. By contast, you come off as very tiresome. Do you have any skin in the game? What are you doing to help make housing affordable? Do you do anything besides exemplify why having revolutionaries in charge would be terrifying?
Stop crying and provide housing for yourself then.
Once the Class Conciousness is ripe!Mao has entered the chat
