how would you make a linux distro for extreme beginners in tech and elderly people??

You have to be able to do everything you need, including modifying things, updating, installing software, and fixing issues without using the command line at all, and the amount you have to modify and fix really has to be minimal.

Block or remove the terminal and judge the disastrous performance on its ability to work after the fact

I don't know, but I want your wallpaper.

My 90yo neighbor has run Mint since before I met him 15 years ago

Pls send me ur wallpaper (I fucking love stolas)

It's going to sound really silly but here goes:

1. Ensure their background is the same as it was (seriously, they often use it as an extra way to find things).

2. Where possible, use windows icons for desktop shortcuts and mask link names to match vocab they're familiar with.

3. Have rustdesk set up with a link saying "Let <your name> help me".

4. Make sure they have their password written down somewhere.

5. Make sure you have their password written down somewhere.

6. Where possible have background updating, where not possible have a .sh file to do it for them.

7. Add desktop links for things like downloads, documents and pictures.

These are tips for any distro when moving less tech savvy relatives over. For those that like to game, ensure your fs on their gaming drive is a Linux one as it stops weird behaviour. Also, you know, install the games for them!

Something that automatically updates. Despite my best efforts my mom still has me update her Mint install.

Aurora Linux + KDE

It's an immutable version of Fedora with flatpack support.

This is actually a good setup for the vast majority of people.

You can just have them test out some distros with Hyper-V.

I like Kubuntu.

Those newfangled immutable distros might benefit them, since they're unlikely to want to or care about modification, and it's extra security.

Set up the web browser with a strong ad-blocker, maybe whitelisting YouTube since non-techy people are unlikely to know what to do if youtube throws up a stink about the adblocker.

Set up auto-updates maybe. For safety and such.

Otherwise make sure it looks like a dead ringer for whatever they are already used to (usually Windows) -- Same background, icons in the same places and looking similar if not the same, panels set up the same way, etc. -- This is easier with Cinnamon or KDE Plasma. Gnome... Even if you like it, it's too different, yanno? Unless they're coming from Mac, and even then it's not the same.

P.S.: Lovely background of a gay bird prince. <3

I think linux mint is already there.

I don't even know how could it be simplified more. It's really basic.

The only obstacle there is the previous familiarity with other operative systems that could make change bard. But I'm pretty sure that if you put anyone truly novice in tech in front of linux mint and windows 11, they'll have an easier time on linux mint.

I stopped liking gnome. Let's say you try to launch a wine game and it just doesn't launch. There's no icon to right click on to find out which wine profile it's launching from. The quick launch icon is just there, teasing you and not doing anything useful.

I can right click on a desktop icon in KDE and do something useful with it. KDE has gotten better. It's no longer super buggy on Wayland with Nvidia.

ChromeOS is already an operating system for children. Like, literally. Schools use it because it works well and is really easy to use, and runs on very cheap hardware.

Auto update only critical and likely attack vectors (the kernel, network stack) and have them applied when shutting down, have visual hints that explain to them what each thing is and make it immutable.

Honestly, there isn't much to it when setting up Linux for elderly people - in fact, I find it less troublesome than setting it up for a teenager.

Most often the issues regular users face with Linux are related to installing packages from external sources or broken updates. Elderly people tend to not do that.

Set up a stable distro like Debian, Linux Mint or Ubuntu LTS with KDE Plasma or Cinnamon, install LibreOffice, Okular and a browser with strong ad blocking, and any other applications you think they might need. Enable a simple firewall, hide the root / folder from the file browser's sidebar, and you're done. Perhaps set up scaling to make everything bigger on their monitors, disable mouse acceleration and set the speed slightly slower than usual.

I wouldn't bother with immutable distros, Flatpaks are nice and all until permissions turn using a simple app a confusing chore with broken interactions.

As someone who used to sell computers to elderly and people who are generally non tech literate, as well as ran computer literacy courses;

ChromeOS + something like flatpak. I don't think anything else will really work in the current linux world. Holding on hope for Cosmic based DE.

A Distro must have

• Easy AND reliable DE. KDE has been way too buggy and gnome has been way too hard for my parents to use. Old people often have an extremely hard time learning, it needs to replicate what they already know which is either going to be Windows or OSX most likely. Cosmic should be able to do both nicely when ready.

Reliability is so fucking key here I can not understate it. The computer glitching out is entirely unacceptable. They will not be able to do any debugging nor will you likely be on call 24/7 to fix their issues. They also need security so you can't just "set and forget" either with no updates in a false sense of stability. Older folk copy and paste shit. Permissions and stability is key here. Flatpak has a lot of potential but it's not there yet.

No real time AV really hurts here.

• Extremely strong app selection with either android or wine app support. Wine is the most preferable. A lot of people are reliant on windows programs for things like tax filing and all sorts of stuff like crochet software and what not. Android apps however can often be good enough and are extremely simple so with a little help, and you will need to help, they can get by with android app support.

• A11y, screenreaders, OSKs, maginifers etc. We need all of it if we want to fit the "generic elderly support"

• Good performance. Elderly people do NOT like updating systems, Their systems will likely be old. And well they are old too. If a system is slower then what they are used to, and generally non responsive, they may think the bloody thing is broken. cough cough gnome cough cough

I genuinely do not that that any DE let alone distro is an acceptable daily driver for "general people" because general people have such a wide variety of use cases and needs. Some folk need crochet and tax software, some folk need CNC software like stitchfiddle, Some need magnifier glasses and speech to text. and man, this is only the more common of things i've seen.

Remeber folk, a PC that does 99% of what people generally need, does not mean that it will fit the needs of 99% of people. Here is hoping to a bright future, but I don't think it will be a close one.

Most of my family run Linux.

My parents run Linux Mint. It’s simple and looks like Windows. The only thing they need is a browser and LibreOffice.

Some other family members are using ElementaryOS.

The majority of PC users are IT illiterate. They have no idea what the difference between Windows and Linux is or the difference between Chrome and Firefox is.

“This icon is your browser. You know, where you can access the bank. And this icon lets you write documents”.

There was always issues when family members was running Windows. Haven’t had to fix anything after installing Linux instead. Some doesn’t even know they are using Linux. I just said I updated their PC 😅

I would make it controlled by voice. Just need to figure out a way to tell the user what the system can do. Computer, help me shop for medicin and hold up a box infront of the screen with what you use today. This should be simple. If you make it to complex like it is today then elder people will not use the computer.

Basically a personal assistent/guide driven OS. Start with rethink the experience you would have if you went to the mall and have a human assistent with a big screen to show you everything.

I have both my parents on KDE with essentially the defaults. They came from Windows 7, so many things were familiar to them, like the systray in the bottom-right, the start-menu in the bottom-left and so on.

I mostly decided to go with KDE, because I use it myself. My dad can be extremely negative, so being able to tell him, nope, it works on my machine, often defuses the situation. But I also expected my parents to potentially want lots of little tweaks, which well, it didn't happen.
They use a browser and a printer, that's basically it. I have considered setting up an E-Mail client for my dad, and thought about setting up tiling window management for my mum, but done nothing so far. The OS could boot straight into Firefox and they would hardly notice.

As such, I'm definitely fine with how little problems they've had using KDE.
One time, I noticed my dad had a million tabs open in the file manager, because that got updated to remember open tabs, and something he did, would always open a new tab in there. Another time, he had managed to create a second panel, which sat at the top of the screen wasting space.
So, it would be somewhat nicer, if he couldn't do that stuff, but at the same time, it's not really a problem and I learned computers by dicking around, too, so I really don't feel like I want to lock that down somehow.

A dumb thing he did one time, which he could do independent of the desktop environment, is that he deleted all the folders in his home-directory. Intentionally. He has this habit of cleaning everything up, completely disregarding that he has like 99% free storage space. Again, he doesn't really use much beyond a web browser, and he didn't find out about hidden folders, so the only real effect was that his wallpaper disappeared.

I don't think that's the answer you wanted, but yeah, I would not want to lock them down to prevent this stuff from happening, unless it really becomes a problem.

Adopt windows file system with letterer partitions as the root. Plus most people who use computers are used to this paradigm already. Who ever came up with Linux's file system has poor organization skills

A wallpaper with Stolas incentivizes me for sure, but unlikely for beginners or elderlies, unless they like Stolas also.

Mint/elementary are good if on windows 10/Mac respectively

What I would say is what is your reason for converting people, because you're going to end up as permanent tech support this way when they'd have probably been fine with a Mac or something

Remember the "Jitterbug" mobile phone made specifically for older users?

Kindof in the spirit of that.

Don't hide things in a "start menu" or anything like that. No task bar. Just put a small number of big icons on the "desktop". Open all applications in fullscreen. Don't allow two applications to run at the same time. Optimally, the browser wouldn't be as general-purpose as Firefox or Chromium or whatever. No address bar. Just links to a few bookmarked sites. In fact, no home page on the browser would be good. Just make the websites they have available to go to more icons on the GUI's main desktop. Don't make them right-click for anything, only left-click. But make it easy for people's family to get at the guts, including remotely, to customize the experience for the intended user.

I would try to copy the usability of macOS/Windows as much as possible without being different for the sake of being different. They should never have to look at the command line if they don't want to.

These are solved problems.

For elderly people, an interface with options to have big icons and accessibility options would be very helpful; and accessing a program should take no longer than 4 clicks via mouse, or 6 keyboard keys.

GNOME interface succeeds well in that, as you can click Super key and be able to search between all the existing apps. Or the top left Applications menu could be used to browse through all programs.

For beginners in tech; GUIs for installing programs would be a big help. New people might see writing console commands for installing programs complicated, compared to other OS's show their app stores in a visible location. Also do not make users search for graphics drivers.

I fixed this by using Debian and Firefox. The only thing my parents do on the PC is stuff on the internet. It’s just important that it opens itself after the startup. They love the speed of it.

Mint and Fedora based distros already do it good

Any more simpler and it would be an atomic distro that focuses mainly on flatpak and chromium

Wallpaper?

Linux Mint, just ensure the hardware is 100% supported.

Why would it have to be KDE or XFCE? GNOME as it exists today is probably the closest to macOS' design language, and whatever you do designing any kind of operating system UI, macOS needs to be the benchmark. GNOME 2 in the olden days was my favorite DE so today I have to go for things like KDE or MATE but I'm not a novice and I can fully acknowledge that what works for me isn't what works for everyone. GNOME probably made the right decisions to lower the entry barrier towards Linux.

XFCE to me is purely a choice for outdated hardware so unless your extreme beginner has an extremely old PC XFCE is a non-starter. Whether KDE can be made more accessible to the non-initiated I can't say. Anything that has a Windows-esque taskbar is probably ill-equipped from the start as well. Again, macOS is as easy to use in a keyboard and mouse sense as tablets and smartphones are with our fingers. This is the way.

@[email protected] most of the issues elderly or someone not familiar with tech might face is installing something. pop os is the answer i think.