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This is what happens when we let conservatives have any sort of power in society
any sort of power, they have it ALL now, because not enough Democrats figured it was important enough to simply cast a vote in Novembers election. more arab and latino americans voted for donald trump than have ever voted for any republican candidate before in american history. leftists told anyone that would listen they weren't going to vote for "genocide joe" while marching on every major american city chanting "from the river to the sea", while flooding social media with anti israel and anti democratic party messaging, the result of which was democratic youth vote was the lowest it's ever been in american history, while republican youth vote was the highest it's ever been. with everything on the line democratic youth couldn't find it within themselves to defend the republic, by doing the lowest effort simplest action by casting a ballot in a safe, free, and fair election. donald trump won his second term as president by ~2.3% of the vote.
I just want to clarify that Arab and Latino Americans voting for Trump is marginal and would be insignificant if white voters weren't in the bag for fascism already.
White women are the only marginalized group that fuck with Republicans in numbers.
A hearty lmao at the idea that white women are marginalized.
They don't have control over their bodies. That's fucking marginalized.
They are.
Marginalized groups can be more or less marginalized than others. That does not make them powerful relative to the rich-ass white men that run the world through financial influence alone.
Ya'll motherfuckers act like just cause women can vote now, sexism is "solved."
Do not engage the incel
Women who are 50% of the US population had the opportunity to vote for the first black woman president, protect their reproductive rights and instead 53% of the women who did turn up voted for the pussy grabbing rapist.
Maybe you should deal with the traitors in your own house.
Because a marginalized group has never been misled to accept and excuse abuse before. What a fuckin' take.
Not sure what you mean by my "own house." American white women are a demographic I'm displaced from in a number of ways.
Whatever dude. People having to pretend like they give a fuck what Karen has to say is half the reason we are in this mess.
They are powerful relative to “rich white ass-men” because they hold their cocks. Wake up.
It's all about the nuances... baby boomers as a cohort are responsible for many of today's problems and yet individual boomers are not. The elderly get roped into the defence of boomers even though there's plenty of older people than them that actually helped setup the prosperity that boomers ruined.
Karens are frustrating and their voices are loud, but to even compare them to predator class humans like billionaires or rapists is waay out of touch.
They literally don't have the same rights as men, they are marginalized, you God damn misogynist.
There isn’t a more protected class of people than an American white woman. You’re right, they have way more rights than men, you Goddamn misandrist.
And my man wonders why he can’t get laid with that great personality and very big brain.
You should probably not try to swallow a red pill that large. You'll choke.
Blaming the voters is most of the reason you're in the position you're in, you do understand that, right?
Why blame politicians running bad campaigns when you can blame the voters for not being invested in a bad campaign?
¿Por Qué No Los Dos?
I am not going to defend the democrats one bit. I voted for them in order to oppose this shit storm we find ourselves in.
However, anybody who voted for Trump was alive for his first term, and he got MORE votes this time around. Fuck the voters.
Yep. And this way you don't need to make any changes, or do even the smallest amount of introspection. Just keep fucking up the same way, over and over again.
It's also an easy/lazy excuse to absolve themselves from responsibility.
Like, OK, if voting is the only mechanism, did you spend time on the phones or on the streets convincing people how to vote? Or talking to representatives about policy? Somehow I doubt it.
I have a suspicion this type of person would be terrible at convincing people to vote a certain way.
I voted for Harris in nov. But you are blaming the people with the least amount of power.
Democrats could have… you know… appealed to their voters instead of fund and arm a genocide, fund the police more than has ever been done, and ran on racist border fascism. They didn’t appeal to their voters and their voters didn’t show. Harris, Biden and all the people advising them should be the ones we direct our anger at not the voters who didn’t vote for something they weren’t inspired by.
Yeah agreed on all of that and yet the vote was still the easiest fucking choice of our lifetimes
Agreed. If voting was really easy or mandatory Harris would have won. But republicans and the courts make it hard so that there are tons of barriers for people to cast non fascist votes.
I filled out 2 forms and mailed them to my election office during the 2 months preceding the election. How much easier can we make it?
Much easier. Automatic registration, mail in ballots, etc etc. More progressive states are much better at this.
But Republicans purged voter rolls, made sure lines were extremely long by under staffing, made it illegal to hand out food and water in lines, making it illegal for felons to vote when felons are intentionally mostly poor and minorities, etc etc etc.
your experiences are not universal. The more marginalized a person is the more likely it will be hard for them to vote.
Sure, but none of that competes with the causes "I just didn't feel like it" or "I'm not into politics".
Well, grats. Politics are into you.
We could make it that easy in every state instead of just yours.
To vote in Texas:
- Make an appointment at the Department of Public Safety. The wait time is 4 months, and the appointment has to be at least one month before the election.
- Have all your paperwork in order on the first try. Note that the paperwork required may have changed between the time you made the appointment and the date itself.
- Get a few hours off of work on election day. Companies are not required to give you that time.
- Wait in line, in the worst case over two hours
- Vote
Restrictions on voting were put in place in many places around the country
In the wake of former President Donald Trump’s lies about a stolen election in 2020, many state legislatures implemented new laws restricting voter accessibility in key parts of the voting process.
Passed in more than half of U.S. states, the laws are often part of sweeping bills that targeted multiple parts of the process, including absentee voting, early voting, and Election Day voting. They mostly come from Republican-led legislatures.
How much easier can we make it?
Much. Automated voter registration, national holiday to give everyone a time outside of work to vote, national mail-in voting, penalty fee for those who didn't vote (like Australia, something small like $5), change from FPTP to a STAR or Ranked or Approval Voting system, better information sent to each voter about the running candidates, ect
Seriously, the government knows how old you are. Birth certificates, IDs, taxes, insurance, school requirements, requirement to sign up for the draft if you are a man by 18. They know where you live and how to find you. Most people down to a ~10 meter radius at all times unless you don't have your phone on you. Everyone should be automatically registered for presidential & VP voting. If you have an ID then they recorded your address to acquire the ID. You should be automatically assigned to that addresses precinct/district/county/state/federal officials that come from that area. If you do not have an ID, you should be able to go online or in person to submit a proof of address for free. If a person votes twice, it should flag the federal government for having 2 votes from the same individual, the state, county, district and precinct without an issue. All precincts have cameras and you aren't allowed to wear face coverings (hair allowed) when voting. This means when you receive a ballot there wil be a recording of you being present. If the person attempts votes twice, they can confirm if it was the same person or if someone was trying to vote in their place.
Up the voter fraud charge to minimum 10 years in prison unless coerced and fully cooperate in apprehending whomever did such; who should be charged with the equivalent of treason. (Life in prison, or the death penalty.... Not my personal choice, that's just the penalty for treason federally).
I'd say more but I've already rambled and I'm sure I've said enough to find dispute in many.
Fuck the genocide. We have a real crisis at home now because people put another country ahead of ours.
Again, I agree as I voted for Harris. But the real villains are the people with actual power who made consequential decisions that fucked us all.
I agree with you on that. They rolled right over before it was even bedtime on election night.
I would hope that someone else would do the same for me. We are all humans together, national barriers are a fiction made up by those who want to oppress you.
I don't. These people clearly did not vote with Gaza's best interests in mind.
If you want to fuck both our counties with virtue signaling, well you can fuck right off.
Nah, virtue signalling isn't what got us here. It's spineless fucks who keep expecting fascists to fight fair.
So you are saying that you will happily sacrifice minorities abroad so long as you can get your way?
I think they are saying that they would begrudgingly vote for a candidate that may not fit their views or morals entirely in consideration of a historically complex and volatile situation going on in a different country that would continue regardless of the election here, in order to prevent a worse situation from forming there, and prevent a fascist regime from taking hold in their own country.
On a related note, who did you vote for?
I begrudgingly voted for Harris, but i understand why millions of people that voted for Biden in 2020 didn't vote for her. The system is inherently broken and Harris was offering to keep things the same. Until the Dems try to actually earn votes, not just be the default, they will continue to eat shit in elections.
She was an idiot for making it appear she was going to keep things the same, but I doubt she would have. She was basically looking at "more people than ever before in any election ever voted for Biden" and he's decaying and I need his voter base to win, so she didn't want to speak poorly of him
Edit: for info, Biden had almost $4 million more votes in 2020 than Trump in 2024 while the population grew by 6 million people. Meaning as much as the GOP is selling that Trump did historic things in voting, Biden was vastly more popular than Trump
Throw in: percentage wise, Biden beat Trump in 2020 more than 3x as bad as Trump beat Harris in 2024. Yet they call it a historical or "huge" win
She was an idiot for making it appear she was going to keep things the same, but I doubt she would have.
When you run to the right, the right doesn't buy it. The left does.
She was basically looking at “more people than ever before in any election ever voted for Biden” and he’s decaying and I need his voter base to win, so she didn’t want to speak poorly of him
She was willing to contradict him by moving to his right.
What did she say that was moving to his right?
She said she would appoint a Republican to her cabinet, something Biden did not do.
So, what is your answer to your own question up there?
Aside from what Byremeister said (which was spot on) when the choice is save minorities at home, I will always vote yes.
It's interesting that I see this kind of sentiment, shifting the blame onto everyone who's anti-genocide, mostly from people who were also repeatedly defending if not downplaying Israel's genocide. I wonder how your removed comments in the modlogs look.
There were many issues with how the Democratic Party ran their campaign.
Democrats' Working-Class Failures, Analysis Finds, Are 'Why Trump Beat Harris'
2024 Post-Election Report: A retrospective and longitudinal data analysis on why Trump beat Harris
The slogan From the River to the Sea is about Palestinian liberation that started in the 60s by the PLO for a democratic secular state, not Genocide. The Syrian leader Hafez al-Assad in 1966 maybe, but he's not Palestinian. While there's been 500+ Instances of Israeli Incitement to Genocide – Continuously Updated, on top of Netanyahu explicitly stating “between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty.”
The real time shift from "we don't need you to win against Trump!" to "please God vote for Harris!" to "Why didn't you vote for the candidate who forgot your kind is being murdered?" from liberals is maddening.
Gaslighting is rampant with both sports teams.
Idiotic take. Congratulations on enabling the nazi takeover.
Genocide was so precious to your wing of the party that they would prefer a nazi takeover to abandoning it.
I voted for Harris in California and voted in all local ballots except for the ones with republicans due to blanket primaries. I'm more of a target for Nazis than most americans are.
Removed, I forgot I commented already, ignore this one.
mostly from people downplaying genocide
Dunno who you're talking about in specific but I have seen literally zero of this. Almost all of the major sources of "just fucking vote against Trump or Gaza will be far worse off" were from people who were also against the genocide. That's kind of the entire fucking point.
Seeing people dismiss it the way you did just screams "I refuse to admit I was wrong so I'll just try to blame the people telling me that exactly what is currently happening, would happen"
I've tagged people I've argued with previously that have repeatedly posted disinformation used to justify Israel's Apartheid and Genocide as Zionist for over a year. I'm talking about those people specifically
I also voted for Harris and advocated for people to voter for her despite the Democrats foreign policy. Some people are genuinely angry at everyone who didn't vote Dem. Others are specifically trying to discredit anyone advocating for Palestinian emancipation
Others are specifically trying to discredit anyone advocating for Palestinian emancipation
This describes all of centrist lemmy.
If they were too insignificant to listen to, they're too insignificant to blame.
Oh yeah I meant more that giving them any sort of power inevitably leads to this
Interestingly the gEnOcIdE posts are way fewer nowadays.
Don't get me wrong, I think bibi is a war criminal, but there were absolutely very very few debates or discussions, almost only astroturfing hatespeek IMO, basically shut up or you are a "genocider", which doesn't advance anything sane, again IMO.
Yes, because you were all voting for politicians who were complicit in that genocide. Then the election happened, and the quasi-ceasefire (really, relocation of hostilities to the West Bank, until they almost inevitably resume in Gaza again) happened. And you're all still clinging to the "it was a spoiler designed to cost Dems the election" and yet you're still completely failing to ask the absolutely fundamental question of why the Democrat politicians would rather give up an election than give up being complicit in genocide.
The sheer fact that you write "genocide" in the "I'm an idiot" up-and-down caps, by the way. It meets the legal definition of genocide. It means the intent of laws authored against genocide. It meets the structural characteristics of past genocides. You have to be a truly sick person to trivialize it like that. It's really striking how much trivializing the genocide like that goes hand-in-hand with blaming its critics for the Democrat's loss - it's always the same people doing both. Are we not living in the same planet, where genocide is literally the worst crime imaginable, besides causing the extinction of the entire human race or all life of Earth? Does a politician's complicity in genocide not completely discredit everything they say or do as a facade to gain power and wealth? Does it not reveal an absolute deception that's fundamental to our entire social system? Be honest, have you even thought about those questions?
You guys really want to shift the agenda to something else, but I'm going to describe this exactly as it is. This system is fucked and completely captive, Ds and Rs both. Whoever you think is to blame - at the end of the day, it's not even relevant, because we need complete systemic change. The fact that both parties were near-unanimously complicit in a genocide and the genocidal incitement mythology around it should have been an absolute clarion call to the public for absolute rejection of the people in power. But instead you're all still dicking around playing partisan politics, downplaying that genocide, and trying to relocate the blame for the crumbling society to the general public. The problem here is that we live in a deeply fascist, totalitarian system, at the heart of a global military empire. The mass murder our politicians - across the aisle - commit abroad is a reflection of the inherent immorality and exploitation inherent in this system. Now they've put the "bad cops" back in power after the "good cops" absolutely threw the election, and guess what, it's the "we're tightening our belts, abolishing a bunch of civil rights, and making this even more of a police state" routine again. Not just confined to the last...two weeks under Trump's rule, but oh-so-coincidentally, the same totalitarian police state shit that was already completely rearing its head under George W. Bush and Obama. There was not some sudden shift to fascism in the last two weeks. We've been under it. They've been hammering it in bit by bit our entire lives. This is an objective truth - between the NSA mass surveillance, the PATRIOT Act, FISA surveillance, CIA black sites, targeted assassinations of U.S. citizens, everything. None of this is new. So revise your explanation of this society, because it's not correct.
I'm not american.
And if I have to spell it out for you, the gEnOcIdErs were astroturfers screaming and blocking any sane discussion IMO.
I wrote bibi is a war criminal, if that is not enough for you then what can I say.
I wrote bibi is a war criminal, if that is not enough for you then what can I say.
Which crimes do you suspect him of? Let's see if you can say genocide.
Of course it's genocide. What in the world did you think I thought it was?
You're fighting the wrong battle here.
I thought you were calling him a war criminal to avoid using the word genocide.
Genocide denial can and does happen on lemmy.
Turns out genocide is a spectrum, and they're gonna get to experience all of it.
Trump proposes permanent displacement of Gazans as he welcomes Netanyahu to White House
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2025/02/04/trump-netanyahu-meeting/
Genocide is the only policy that centrists don't abandon. Don't get mad at me because you don't like the guy who implements it for you.
Whatever.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Gaza_war_ceasefire
Try knowing just a small fucking fraction of a topic before you have opinions on things.
That said, Republican collusion with people like Bibi to extend conflict as a weapon against Democratic presidents is an old play for them.
So much anger.
Can you imagine being angry about genocide?
No shit. Look around.
Better the republicans have the power instead of those fucking shitlibs.
🤡
Thanks, SatansMaggotyCumFart. Enlightening as always.
It's funny because this is just as bad if it's trolling or not, it's so immensely bad either way. It's mentally an edgy 12-year-old either way, so you succeeded in nothing other than showing everyone what a childish and pathetic dirtbag you are no matter if troll or not.
And that makes it so funny, you basically go out into a crowd and put a sign up saying "hey, I'm a miserable bag of meat that is mentally a child and so starved of attention because of how shitty I am that I post really pathetic comments online".
Gonna get downvoted, but conservative ideals should be present to some minor extent to balance things out. I don't mean modern conservatives or Republicans, but the concept of fiscal conservatism (e.g. preventing waste in the military). I'm not talking about the fIsCaL cOnSeRvAtIsM that current Republicans preach either, like hollowing out social programs to give tax cuts to their buddies. So yeah that's of course not what we have now, but there should be a healthy balance for that kind of thing.
The problem is that what you describe is not conservatism, it's just basic competence in governance. It's an impressive achievement of the radical right that they have managed to get people to conflate the two.
Sure that's fair. Whatever you want to label it, there needs to be some kind of balances against full progressivism so it doesn't go extremely far to the left. I say this as a pretty far left progressive in most things, but have some minor conservative ideals (such as individuals wanting to support themselves without relying on outside sources). Again, I'm well aware that's not modern Conservatism in the US these days.
such as individuals wanting to support themselves without relying on outside sources
You mean we shouldn't have social welfare programs?
No public healthcare, no public housing, no public infrastructure, no public health services, no free public education, no social security, no universal basic income
How are any of these bad?
Knowing Better has an incredibly informative video about the history of meritocracy, rugged individualism, and fiscal responsibility in America. I think you'd find it interesting
Who said any of that? You're making up stuff I didn't say...
People that need help should absolutely get it in all those forms. I'm talking about like, not participating in the economy as much. Growing your own food, relying on yourself as much as possible. Like I said in other comments here, I think I've horseshoed around off the left and I've ended up in a hyper-local community driven economy mindset.
When you mentioned conservative values of not relying on outside sources, that's what I thought of due to the historical context of individualism that the video goes over. Didn't mean to imply you were personally against those things.
I'm talking about like, not participating in the economy as much. Growing your own food, relying on yourself as much as possible
I'm guessing you're referencing reducing personal consumption? I'm supportive of that, the idea is rooted in anti-capitalist sentiment. Growing your own food is just a fun hobby, I don't think that has any real political leaning. Food Cooperatives with local communities, such as a neighborhood garden, are left-leaning tho.
Conservatives have historically used the rhetoric of "relying on yourself, not others" to justify gutting social services and replacing them with private businesses as a way to accelerate profit seeking.
No, community driven is great. I want to do more myself
The people who say this tend to forget that if you only take the "good things" from conservatism it ceases to be conservatism. The conservative ideology is garbage and only leads countries to a sort of destructive cannabalism.
Basically what I mean is the mindset of doing everything possible in your power to be self-sufficient. I think I've gone so far off the left side I've horseshoed around. Everyone should be striving to be as self-sufficient as possible and not need to rely on external forces. I'm far from it, but I'm trying, at least given the past few years (and especially this month) I'm preparing for bad situations.
That is the mindset that got us here. Maybe it will help to double down, but the reality is we don't know, we're in uncharted waters
I'm not saying the government shouldn't help the people who need it though. Bring back FDR. I think that's the big reason why I'm not actually conservative. The help should be there, but people should have an internal desire to rely on outside forces as little as possible. I think many already have that desire, but not enough by far.
Describing the good of the opinions that are more on the right side of the spectrum isn't going to come across as good if you use conservatives to describe it.
You won't get downvoted. Ideally you'd have both parties suck it up and work together and combine ideologies. But.. well you know... Babies
Nah, I'm not talking about the actual current Republican party nowadays. They need to die out and form a new party that's actually conservative. It's the most corrupt swamp straight outta Uzbekistan or Russia at this point. The things they're doing now, no Democrats should compromise on ever.
Ideally you wouldn't have two parties, but have an odd number of parties to figure it out. So three at minimum
Ideally you'd have multi-party coalition districts with RCV or STV to elect them. We have a duopoly because of FPTP.
Ideally people wouldn’t use abbreviations in general context. Searching for it on Ecosia doesn’t help that much either.
But coalitions are a mess on their own, just check politics in Europe. At least Geert Wilders is only an example for Trump and nowhere near as bas