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What is there to negotiate? If all the russians leave ukraine, ukranians will probably stop shooting them...
Russia has always firmly opposed expansion of NATO, including the missiles and NATO troops that were lined up at their border with Ukraine’s participation.
Why does Russia get to dictate what other countries do within their borders?
I’m pretty sure every country on earth would respond to a hostile force amassing troops & missiles at their border.
I've always plainly stated that if anyone comes within 2 metres of me, I'm going to stab them. What do you mean, I'm going to prison??!! You knew my rule. I've been telling everyone my rule for 20 years.
Do you think that NATO was planning to invade Russia? And if not, then WTF is Putin's problem?
The primary mission of NATO is aggression with the Soviet Union/Russia. That’s the only reason it exists.
"The United States should invade a country that might in the future join an alliance to help prevent the US from invading other countries as we have in the past." Do you realize how fucking stupid your nAtO eXpAnSiOn propaganda sounds!?
I’m literally just plainly stating historical events.
You are doing nothing of the sort, you are literally just regurgitating Putin propaganda.
...that just so happen to line up with the propaganda of the Russian invaders.
Facts don’t stop being facts when a Russian says them. If they’re factually stating the sequence of events, it doesn’t change anything.
Lies aren't facts, Einstein.
Lies don't become true just because you keep saying "facts". The Russian propaganda (that you're parroting) is the untrue part, not the events themselves. Ukraine defending itself against Russia before and during their violent, illegal invasion is not an "expansion" and has nothing to do with NATO. Full stop.
I would go one further. Ukraine trying to join NATO is not a valid reason for an invasion. In fact, I can't think of any valid reason for an invasion. Invading a country is wrong.
Maybe Ukraine wants to join NATO because they share a border with a gigantic country that wants to conquer them.
The amusing part is the invasion actually got Finland to join NATO, which, to my knowledge, did not have prior plans to do so.
If the goal of the invasion was to prevent NATO expanding to russian borders, they've already failed at it.
All those countries that joined NATO, Their sovereignty doesn't end where hurt russian fee-fees begin
if Russia doesnt like it, then maybe they should reflect on how they acted like savage barbarians to those people throughout history. Maybe they should reflect that they aren't entiteld to an "Empire" or a "Sphere of Influence" or whatever they want to call it. Reflect on the fact that Eastern and Central europe are not pawns and slaves to a larger power. but nations with agency, hopes, dreams and goals.
but they wont, Imperialism, Warmongering, and Genocide are married to the current excuse of "Russian Culture"
Yeah like, instead of taking a hard look into the mirror why countries kept wanting to join NATO, or why the russian-bloc equivalent failed so much, LULZ WE JUST GONNA WALTZ IN NO NATO PLOX.
Ah, nevermind, they did discover why so many countries wanted to join NATO. 😂
If it was about their sovereignty, it’s weird that you don’t mind NATO attacking their sovereignty to install pro-western politicians through corruption or straight up coups. “Sovereignty” only seems to matter when it’s anti-Russian.
It’s not about feelings. There were many agreements for NATO not to expand. They did it anyway. There are consequences for that.
There were many agreements for NATO not to expand.
Oh were there?
That's interesting, considering how controversial it still is whether oral agreements ever existed in the first place. What isn't controversial is of course that being oral-only, they can hardly be binding or transactionary. That is to say, the failure was to never transfer these agreements - if they even existed - into writing, bilaterally as that's how you'd have to do it.
“We didn’t agree in writing” didn’t seem to prevent a war from breaking the agreement.
Please educate me. Which countries had pro-western politicians "Installed"
And if you're already typing Ukraine, boy do I have a bridge to sell you.
With maybe the exception of Serbia, Russia has been antagonistic and Imperialistic towards Europe for CENTURIES. Theres a reason Russia finds itself fighting against most/all of Europe every century. You need only ask the butchered populations of Eastern Europe who found themselves as Russian subjects at any point in history. The only reason they were ever friendly with Serbia, was because the Serbs are like a microchasm of the same thing the Russians did. Mini-mes, if you will.
you want to scream America bad, NATO bad, fine. but remove both of them from the equation, it wouldnt change the fact that the continent distrusts Russia for a reason.
Ukraine, Georgia, Bulgaria, Romania, etc.
😂 Geezus some people are so far down the disinformation hole there's fuck all ways to dig them back out, ever...
Oh boy
So if they installed pro-western politicians in Ukraine, Why was the president of Ukraine at the time of Euromaidan checks notes Viktor Yanukovitch? the Pro-Russian fraudster who was once removed from the presidency after having cheated in the elections. and even afterward, managed to ratfuck his way into a term later on in 2010. Only to get Impeached and removed from power By his own government after he ordered the Berkut and Internal Troops to use lethal force against protestors.
this tired argument of western coups against these ex soviet countries always forgets to address the fact that a couple of suspicious phonecalls in embassies doesn't hold the same power as millions of people taking to the streets over a government doing something that is widely unpopular.
if the CIA and all these other groups people accuse of toppling governments were as competent as fiction made them out to be, Joe Biden would still be President, Putin would be dead, Russia would be a balkanized state, and the Ukraine war would probably never have happened, and if it did, it would have been over by now with a Ukrainian victory.
No, you’re describing the Maidan Coup, which was backed by the US to install a far-right puppet regime because they opposed Yanukovitch maintaining neutrality with Russia, and not bowing to US demands to block a lease on a Crimean naval base.
Except Ukraine was on their border and not part of NATO and other countries on their border are. NATO Then Russia invaded and took the Crimean peninsula unprovoked. Not a surprise that Ukraine wants NATO membership, and now Finland joined NATO because of Russia's attack on Ukraine, doubling the NATO/Russia border.
Incorrect. The Crimea invasion followed a soft coup of Ukraine by the US, wherein they installed a far-right puppet regime. The following years, Ukraine allowed a torrent of NATO & US troops and missile deployments to be installed at their border with Russia.
Nope... you're spreading bullshit. People got rid of a Putin puppet. Hope we do the same.
Where did you come up with this? At no time has the US or NATO had troops or missiles in Ukraine. Get your facts correct or say nothing.
“At no time,” when they’re there as we speak. So stupid.
You really ought to take to news sources other than Twitter or Telegram. 😂
My man, if we had US troops and missiles participating in the war, Kursk would have already been a proud Ukrainian city.
NATO wouldn't need to expand if Russia wasn't constantly threatening their neighbors.
They’ve only ever threatened their neighbors during NATO expansion efforts.
Complete horseshit. They literally invaded and installed a puppet regime in Chechnia, and there were zero NATO "expansion efforts" there. And that is just one example out of many.
Russia was threatening their neighbors before NATO even existed.
NATO existed before Russia, genius. It’s an anti-Soviet org.
Your immense historical knowledge seems to have missed the fact that Russia existed long before the Soviet Union, Einstein.
You’re proposing that this Russia is the same one? When did they re-establish the czar?
The Soviet Union was still Russia. They've not changed their attitude since then.
Then explain this different government, economy, and borders.
They’ve only ever threatened their neighbors during NATO expansion efforts.
This is abuser logic. "If you would quit misbehaving, then I wouldn't have to hit you!"
It’s an adult understanding of international politics. Aggression rarely goes unanswered.
I see you haven't spoken to many people from Finland... Or Latvia... Or Syria... Or Chechnya... Or Ukrainians, for that matter.
You wanna name anymore western imperialist projects?
"Everyone who's afraid of Russia (for good reason) is a western imperialist project"
NATO hasn't "expanded" in a long time, until recently when Sweden and Finland decided to join. A decision that was made based on the Russian invasion of Ukraine. So through Russia's actions, two countries have decided to join an organisation that was made to opposed Russia.
Before that, no new members were accepted into NATO, even if they wanted to join, because NATO members weren't really seeing the point of NATO anymore, and they didn't see a reason to provoke Russia. That changed in 2014 when Russia invaded Ukraine for the first time, and annexed Crimea.
Last but not least; NATO doesn't expand. It's not a nation with borders that grow through conquest or subjugation. It is a defensive pact that the peolpe of a nation must vote on to join. And then the members of NATO must unanimously vote on letting the new country join. It is voluntary and democratic.
So instead of shoutong "NATO IS EXPANDING, GRRR!!", why not ask yourself "why would Russia's neighbouring countries want to join NATO?"
Completely untrue. NATO has been expanding since the 90’s.
Of course it has. Of course it has. I mean, if your dillusions help you find your happy place, who am I to judge, right?
Fact check me.