An Iraqi man who carried out several Quran burnings in Sweden has been killed
An Iraqi man who carried out several Quran burnings in Sweden has been killed
A judge in Stockholm says an Iraqi man who carried out several Quran burnings in Sweden has died. Swedish media reported Thursday that he was killed in a shooting in a nearby city.
Summary
Salwan Momika, the Iraqi man who staged several Quran burnings in Sweden in 2023, was shot and killed in Sodertalje, near Stockholm.
His actions had sparked international outrage, riots, and diplomatic tensions. Swedish police confirmed a murder investigation is underway, and several arrests have been made.
Momika, who sought asylum in Sweden in 2018, faced charges of incitement to hatred, with a verdict scheduled for the day after his death.
His protests were permitted under free speech laws but led to legal action against him.
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Fuck it, now I kind of want to burn a Quran or Bible for funsies.
why not both?
Toss in a torah to complete the Abrahamic trifecta and top it with dianetics because fuck scientology in particular.
momika did it specifically to spark outrage among immigrants. don't do that.
Nah fuck that, If muslims cant handle it they should look the other way like they do when women are stoned to death for showing their hair.
Good one. Throw in another joke in about Jews owning all the banks, newspapers and an elite pedo sex ring cabal. Haha. Aren't these racist jokes funny?
One of them is true and one is racist. Guess which is which
There are at least 8 countries that apply sharia as their modus in criminal and family law.
Yemen, Saudi arabia, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, mauretania and Ethiopia.
You think that's funny?
And thats not even mentioning the backwards ass Christian countries that also apply the Bible to criminal law.
Great list of countries colonized by the West. America implement that Sharia law for them? That freedom and liberalism really inspired them.
Oh, right. I forgot that everything is Americas fault. Especially the islamic theocracy. Has nothing to do with the fact that every sovereign power in the middle east funds fundamentalist insurgents in each others countries to destabalize them.
Pakistan, i'm looking at you.
Thanks for generalizing 1.5bn people, Ben Affleck
Oh, so not a small minority. Good to have that cleared up. Show me a liberal, free muslim country, then i can show you all of them that are not.
Iran... Oh wait destroyed and overthrown by Liberals in 1953
Show me a Muslim country which has not been invaded, colonized and destroyed by Liberals first.
Arabia went from being under Ottoman rule to being under the house of Al Saud, it's never been colonized by a western "liberal" country.
Their rules are still insane.
Where do they get all those weapons from to surpress their population?
Let me pull up the map of American military bases in the middle ea... Wow that is a lot of American military bases in Saudi. Must be a coincidence.
Let me help you with that.
Below is the working list of nations that still criminalize consensual same-sex sexual acts between adults
- Algeria
- Afghanistan
- Bangladesh
- Brunei
- Egypt
- Eritrea
- Marocco
- Libya
- Lebanon
- Palestine
- Iran
- Iraq
- Tunisia
- Oman
- Saudi arabia
- Pakistan
- Mauretania
- Mali
And on and on we go.
The only countries that comes close to being reasonably secular are Malaysia and Turkey.
The question was
Show me a Muslim country which has not been invaded, colonized and destroyed by Liberals first.
And literally the first two countries already have been invaded, colonized and destroyed by liberals. And let’s move on, Bangladesh, Egypt, Eritrea, Marocco, Libya, Libanon, Palestine, Iraq, Tunisia, Pakistan, Mauretania, Mali, all former colonies, brutally ransacked, exploited, people enslaved, the very core of each of their societies absolutely destroyed. Make the list longer and the list of ex-colonies gets longer. Ah and then except of course the already mentioned Palestine, which is still an apartheid colony where the liberal west is committing genocide.
You talk about queer rights but you don’t give a single fuck about the fates of the hundreds of millions, if not billions that have been brutalized in the most horrifying ways by the “civilized west“.
Please do us a favor and GTFO with your phony concern for human rights. You just want to shit on brown people. I honestly feel sorry for you, you must be really unhappy carrying around so much hatred with you.
First. Not a question unless you use a questionmark.
Second. The countries have been sovereign states for long enough to know what is morally wrong or not. And you make it sounds like I would have been complicit in some historical injustices. I think you know that this is wrong.
Third. This has nothing to do with skin color, but only the legislation to harm dissidents. Other religions have similar problems, Christianity is no different, just look at some of the other countries that have this legislation.
Cool list. That is a lot of countries colonized and destroyed by liberals indeed.
Below is a list of countries currently committing or complicit in genocide:
-
America
-
Germany
-
UK
-
Israel
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Netherlands
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France
-
Canada
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The entire rest of the liberal world
-
I don’t understand the point of your comment.
No, i guess that would be too much to ask.
Care to elaborate? You’re just kind of asking a loaded question, but you don’t make any actual argument.
The worlds largest religion can take some justified critique without hiding behind the excuse of being a "minority".
They flee their countries because of islamic theocracy and bring that religious sensitivity to us. Hilariously enough they burn pride flags and the origin of species in some weird attempt to offend the free countries. It would be laughable, if not for the fact that they kill dissidents.
Christianity is the world‘s largest religion. Not that it makes any difference how big or small any religion is for inciting hatred against it to be wrong or hatred against anyone for that matter. Furthermore, this happened in Sweden and in Sweden Muslims are definitely a minority.
Who is ”they“ in that context? You talk a lot about “them“ doing these things as if that would mean everyone. OTOH I’m Muslim too and I have a large mostly Muslim family and a large friend circle and I mostly consume Arabic media. I can tell you that I’m mostly busy working, doing laundry, thinking about what to cook, wondering which show to watch next, trying to have a social life and being angry about the Gaza genocide and the rise of Nazism in the west. That’s the reality for pretty much everyone I know, except for those lucky bastards who are retired or still in school. But they have their own shit to worry about.
We don’t care about pride flags and crazy people, we have enough of crazy to deal with at home. This guy in particular pissed me off because he was just trying to spread hatred, how does that make the world a better place? Even the Swedish government wanted to get rid of him but couldn’t, because he would be facing torture in Iraq, which btw is the same Iraq that received democracy from our friends in the US and their illegal invasion. Not that Saddam was any better.
Anyway. I hope you get my point, we have other things to worry about than this, the guy was a giant asshole and he should have been tried as was intended instead of being assassinated, but don’t involve me or Muslims in general in that. I’m against capital punishment and I couldn’t think of anyone I know who would be in favor of that, no matter why.
I also don’t start political discussions with my Hindu Indian friends when I see that there’s some lynch mob attacking Muslims somewhere in India and I leave my White American friends alone when there’s the next shooting conducted by a far right guy. So please just give me a break from your generalizations.
Christianity is the world‘s largest religion. Not that it makes any difference how big or small any religion is for inciting hatred against it to be wrong or hatred against anyone for that matter. Furthermore, this happened in Sweden and in Sweden Muslims are definitely a minority.
Doesn't mean that much in a globalized world anymore. The fact is that close to all muslim countries (almost all of which are larger than sweden in population btw) turned this completely legal and frankly, innocent act, into the shitshow that it is. I think he should have torched a Bible too just to prove a point, together with any other book that he can buy for his own money, and do with what he wants. Not defending him, just the principle.
Did you know that Swedish people got killed by muslims in the Netherlands just for wearing swedish football jerseys? For having exactly nothing to do with Salwan.
We don’t care about pride flags and crazy people, we have enough of crazy to deal with at home.
You care enough about it for it to be illegal to be homosexual, that is cruel and unusual in most peoples eyes. And yes you do have plenty of crazy, and due to it being fuled by a proselytic religion, it spreads by design and those who do not follow it are "lesser". Compare that to jewish people, who traditionally doesn't even allow converts to call themselves jewish. They keep to themselves in Sweden and live completely peacefully. Until recently when synagogs in Sweden are ruined by muslims that take up the fight for Gaza by attacking those that have NOTHING to do with the conflict.
This guy in particular pissed me off because he was just trying to spread hatred, how does that make the world a better place?
That's the whole point. Why even care? He is nothing, just another loudmouth that affect nothing from his small echo chamber. It's the reactions from muslims that most people take offense of. When they destroy other civilians property cause "me angry!"
Anyway. I hope you get my point, we have other things to worry about than this, the guy was a giant asshole and he should have been tried as was intended instead of being assassinated, but don’t involve me or Muslims in general in that.
I do get your point, but as long as there are theocracies that push to kill others, then the followers are gonna be blamed. Death to infidels and all that.
Wasn’t that Sam Harris who was being islamophobic and Affleck was defending them?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zsecVLjabzY
Just a stupid joke and I mixed up Ben Affleck with Ethan Hawke
the man wanted to incite hatred, show him middlefinger by doing the opposite
How do we know he wanted that?
I see the post that says he was being charged with inciting hatred, but also says his act was protected under free speech.
I think it’s dumb to be burning books as the only people who are going to be pissed are the fundamentalists and they’re always pissed off anyway, but I respect his right to free expression.
so, momika has been in sweden a few years. he converted to christianity in his home country, started shouting loudly about freedom of speech there, got told to stop, then filed for asylum in sweden. once here he kept doing the same thing, which of course jeopardises his asylum claim. only he wasn't first. rasmus paludan has been burning qurans here for a while, always doing it in neighbourhoods with a majority muslim population. as a demonstration of the problem with religion, it's effective. once. but both of them did it for years, and the things they have been saying during their book burning made it clear that it was not actually about freedom of speech, but about hatred of muslims. not islam, muslims. and they were both in court for the crime of hets mot folkgrupp ("incitement of hatred against a population group"). they clearly overstepped the law of the country they were in.
What other possible reason would someone have to burn a book that is to some more important than their life. Either people dont care about it or become enraged. And just because you have right to do something doesnt mean you should. His actions have caused a lot of harm, also most likely his own death too.
For argument's sake, lets assume he had some positive reason for his actions. Has there been a single positive thing that has come from this? If you want to do good you need to think the consequences through and if you dont then you shouldnt do anything at all.
This is such a bullshit take with some not so subtle apoligism and blame shifting.
If burning a book causes a lot of harm in any way besides burn damage, the burner is hardly to blame but something else is fundamentally wrong, and he tried to make that very obvious to everyone with his own life at risk.
It's not just paper. It's a symbol. If you can't understand that then there's no hope for you in this world. You have a fundamentally flawed view of humanity if you can't see humans ascribe meaning to object, religious or not. It's the same reason burning a flag gets people upset.
You can argue it's irrational, because it obviously is, but humans are not rational creatures.
Now, go only do objective rational things somewhere else. You're words aren't worth anything. You're wasting your effort writing them.
You know that the Nazis in Germany burned a lot of books?
Your general statement would absolve them from their actions and intentions and instead shifts the blame onto the people who got persecuted by having their books burnt. Which later escalated to more than "just" burning books.
You cannot reduce it to the action itself and ignore all the context around it, especially not the intentions of the perpetrators.
And "other people shouldn't get offended if i insult and attack them constantly" is hardly acceptable in any other social context. E.g. i hope you would oppose insulting LGBTQ, Women, Ethnic minorities, disabled people...
And it should be obvious from these examples, that "it is just a joke" or "it is just an insult and i should be allowed to insult, because muuh free speech" is not a sincere argument, by the people spreading the hate. And their intention is never to keep the hate at verbal abuse, but to escalate it to physical violence.
Its not about the PHYSICAL book. Go ask any muslim if there is ANY situation where they would find it acceptable to burn their holy book in such way that guy did. And if he did it to "make it obvious there is something fundamendally wrong" why didnt he then MAKE IT OBVIOUS WHAT IS WRONG? Lets say that was his goal, then he failed so spectacularly words fail me.
I truly dont know what else to say about this if you still dont see what I mean.
And its not nice trying to frame what I said as apoligism or blame shifting. But if you TRULY think so then maybe you should back your arguments with facts instead of throwing words and hoping they stick. I know I can make mistakes and how else can I learn from them than if other people correct me. But i'm pretty sure i'm not wrong about this, but its not good to be blinded by your own surety.
He did it to incite hate. No sane person care about the paper.
I guess if you burn the american flag in Texas, screaming and complaining loudly about"freedom of speech", people will get annoyed, but 20 years ago it was illegal to do so.
So how long have you sided with the Nazis and fundamentalist Christians?
Because now you're excusing their book burning.
What a take.
You see the difference of an individual burning a book that he owns and leaving your books alone and the state burning all the books and forbidding you from accessing them... right?
...what does the state have to do with it? Fundamentalist Christians in the US burned books without state power. Nazis regularly encourage book burning and they haven't had state power in a few decades.
This Nazi, for instance, did not have state power behind him. Just a group of sycophants encouraging his antics.
If you're on the side of a book burning Nazi nut job, you're the bad guy.
What has the state to do with it? Everything. I'm all for nazis burning books, clothes or wood. As long as it's their own and they don't harm anyone. I don't know if he was a Nazi, he was full in his right to burn his own property. If you are worried about what someone does with his own shit, you might be the Nazi.
Right, so if I get a copy of your birth certificate, walk in front of your house after saying you shouldn't exist, and burn your birth certificate you're completely okay and wouldn't think it's a threat against you, right?
If I say 'i hate (insert your race)', and get material that is commonly associated with your local race and culture, and set it on fire in your front yard, you have no problems, right?
So the KKK did nothing wrong, according to your logic.
I'm not saying you really believe that, only a literal bigot would, but that's what you're arguing in order to justify your anti Muslim or anti religious hatred.
In my front yard? That's trespassing, and a fire code violation. Also getting a copy of my birth certificate without my permission is against the law.
You can make an oil painting of me and burn it away from any flammable material.
The kkk was wrong because of the lynchings, and the guy in the news story hasn't killed any Muslims, as far as I know. Quite the contrary, so Que would be saying QED if he weren't dead.
The scale makes all the difference here.
Yes, it's so much better when one group of bigots burn books than a larger group of bigots burn more books.
I guess this is the lesser evil you guys keep voting for, just a little book burning and hate speech, as a compromise.
Just a pro tip, if you are ever on the side of people burning books, you're in the wrong.
Right because your beloved CCP would never censor any books, right? lol
Most people don't live in the 1950s, given its now the 2020s. I get your society hasn't advanced in that time, China has.
Nah, I was referring to June 1989 and of course the Uyghur genocide in Xianjiang which is ongoing today. But the CCP can't even handle it being talked about online much less written about in actual printed books.
When they stop blocking history from the Internet of an entire country, then we can talk about censorship . Until then, you aren't very credible.
edit: for the dear reader, what I am doing here is basically just whataboutism, which I generally try to avoid. But my interlocutor has been all over Lemmy whatabouting in defense of the CCP, so I felt compelled to respond in kind.
Why no Torah?
Because that's be antisemetic and how dare you to anything against the Jewish people, don't you know European persecuted them so the entire world now can't anything to them due to white guilt
Isn’t that basically like burning newspaper? Both would work I guess
Thanks, while we’re at it let’s burn some books by Jewish authors too.
See what I did there? Burning books is never a good look on you.
not sure what you think the bible is
Basically fanfic commissioned by King James VI/I
Your point being?
There's burning all the copies of a book from the local library so no one has a chance to read them, and there's burning one copy of a book which as an estimated 100 million copies printed per year as a protest.
To some the Quran is as hateful as Mein Kampf, and you know what people say about tolerance of intolerance. You may not agree, and you may think books should never be burned. I am on the fence on that. But I do know people who burn books shouldn't be assassinated. And people shouldn't live in fear of reprisals for speaking out against any religion and its teachings.
Yeah I have read both the Quran and some exempts from Mein Kampf. Cannot recommend the latter.
My favorite part from Mein Kampf was the one about the fox, the goose and the tiger who are all assumed to be hostile towards each other. Because of this „Arians“ shouldn’t mingle with Jews. If you’re troubled with following the soundness of the argument that’s because there is none.
Let’s ignore for a second that it’s just outright offensive to compare the books of any world religion to Mein Kampf. Even if you don’t believe in the whole God thing, then the Quran would still be a brilliant collection of verses spoken by some illiterate orphan without any education somewhere in the Arabian desert. And I can tell you that because I‘m a native speaker and even the hardcore atheist Arabs agree with me on that.
I think no one should be assassinated and capital punishment shouldn’t exist. And believe me when I tell you that I want freedom of speech. But there’s freedom of speech and hate speech. I don’t want freedom of hate speech and I don’t care who it is targeting.
I still don’t think anyone deserves capital punishment for anything, but to use this to generalize against all Muslims and our religious books is rightfully being called out as what it is, Islamophobia. Say the exact same things you said just about burning the Torah and we wouldn’t even have to argue about that being antisemitic.
To some the Quran is as hateful as _Mein Kampf
I am atheist/agnostic but it is downright offensive to compare any major religious work from a major world religion (let's arbitrarily define that as more than 1 billion followers I don't intend this as a category of judgement just size) to that shitbook from a genocidal maniac.
The Bible, the Quran, Hindu texts like the Vegas or Upanishads... to say I know more than a passing knowledge about these works would be a lie but I know enough to understand there is real good in those books mixed up with problematic aspects, subject to a constant conversation and study by practicioners that attempts to reconcile and interpret the best parts of those things into a way forward.
Even if you are a staunch atheist there is real meat on the bone in the religious texts I listed above to read critically and consider.
Mein Kampf is just hateful trash, it isn't worth reading, just go read The Magic Mountain by Thomas Mann (Woods translation) or listen to the superb audio book, it came out of Germany at basically the same moment and it is vastly superior in every respect as a work of intellectual and political introspection and it is actually fun.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magic_Mountain
https://campuspress.yale.edu/modernismlab/the-magic-mountain/
I haven't read the Quran or Mein Kampf, but even the old testament is plenty hateful.
Your kid makes fun of some bald dude? Death penalty, mauled by bear.
Add to that (I've heard second hand, correct me if I'm wrong) that there is some pedofilia/child marriage in the Quran, so I see how someone could have strong feelings about it.
The amount of people liking a book shouldn't be an argument to judge its hatrfulness.
I am an atheist/agnostic, I won't be caught dead saying these books aren't deeply problematic, that wasn't my point, my point is that despite all that there is also some good to these books and exploration however fraught of morals and philosophy.
Mein Kampf is just pathetic, lame trash and as I said before it is an insult to those religious works to compare them with a document solely designed to rationalize genocide and hate.
THEY CAN’T KILL US ALL
THEY CAN’T KILL US ALL
You'd be surprised how efficient and streamlined capital punishment is in the middle east. So they probably can. (Unless you're talking about outside the ME, then i doubt it)
Obviously I am not talking about the ME.
Then sorry. I thought so due to him being Iraqi, concern of him being deported and executed, and his reason for burning the Qur'ans originally.
