Laptop Purchase
Laptop Purchase
I'm looking at buying a new laptop which will run EndeavourOS exclusively, no dual boot no modding no nothing.
The choice is either Lenovo or MSI (neither have NVidea grahpics and both have intel i5/i7 chips with integrated graphichs).
Which brand is likely to be more Linux friendly?
There's also an option for a Asus but again i'm only looking at whether i'm likely to run into Linux issues, the specs are virtually the same for all.
Obligatory comment that recommends Framework, as they support linux out of the box.
Aside from that, more important than the brand is the laptop model. Some parts (like fingerprint, camera or touchpad) may not work with linux, and that depends on the model, not the brand. So I'd suggest searching for the model you're interested in, and then combining that search with Arch (usually has the latest - but sometimes unstable - packages, so you'll see what's probably possible), Debian (wide user base, but older packages, so you'll see what definitely works) and then EndeavourOS, to see any issues that may come up that are really relevant for you.
Framework has horrible reviews...
I would probably go with a Dell but to be honest, I don't think any brand feels worth the money.
Honestly asking, who gave them horrible reviews? Have seen some middling ones and support has some negative threads in the forum, but nothing really bad?
I've watched and read a lot of reviews. I don't think any of them were horrible. There were legitimate criticisms like the keyboard flex and the lid flex, but most of what I've seen that's almost ubiquitous is the price per performance worse than other makers. Its fair, but I also think it's a fair tradeoff for modularity and reparability.
I have never seen a negative review that was not price or shipping/doa. They cost about 30% more, and that may or may not be worth it to you. If you want proper Linux support or working power states in windows; it is likely worth it.
As a Dell user, not very happy with mine. Uneven backlight/bleeding, poor build quality (screen glass misaligned with the bezels, keyboard keys coming out which aren't covered under warranty according to Dell, parts of the keyboard failing, trackpad click failing - the trackpad is integrated into the chassis so that had to be replaced) and it's quite overpriced.
That said, some models are Ubuntu certified and get firmware updates without Windows Update
Lenovo ThinkPad
Other options: Framework, Dell Latitude
Used ThinkPads and Dells with Linux for a decade before switching to Framework two years ago. The Framework is great but it's probably not as cheap as you can get a ThinkPad deal for. That said, repair costs on a Framework are likely lower than any other option. Batteries are cheap, motherboards aren't cheap but they're available and very easy to swap, so the next time you have a serious problem you won't have to swap the whole laptop. Assuming Framework remains a good company till then.
I would also add HP Probooks and Elitebooks, which are HP’s business lines, to that list. I have had good experiences with those on a variety of Linux distros.
I'm not sure about MSI, but most Lenovo, especially if it's a business model, will be supported pretty well and will probably have a page on the arch Linux wiki dedicated to it or it's series.
Lenovo has a solid track record of the Linux community getting things working if at all possible. A lot of us like Lenovo laptops.
That said, there's new options where the manufacturer actually actively intentionally supports Linux. The two I am most aware of are System76 and FrameWork.
Framework has an extra price premium because the parts are all replaceable. So probably cheaper in the long run, but more cost upfront.
The feedback I've seen on System76 gives me the impression that the System76 team set out to replace their own Lenovo laptops with something that doesn't need the constant Linux support checks for each hardware generation.
Source: my own shopping for my next laptop.
Framework works good for me and they are supporting linux.
Dont buy Lenovo, both of mine broke after a year of light usage at home. Keyboard buttons on one, trackpad on the other.
They have a reputation from old that they are built like tanks, but Lenovo changed all that and now it's plastic and shitty components.
You can still get a solidly built Lenovo ThinkPad. You just have to ensure you get a T14s or X1 Carbon. Sadly the models that retain the magnesium and carbon fiber aren't very fun to replace parts in.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-T14s-Gen-6-laptop-review-The-AMD-version-returns-with-the-Ryzen-AI-7-Pro-360.923414.0.html#c12325014
Obligatory watch for those interested in buying a new laptop. TL;DW: the latest generation of CPUs is such an improvement over the last one, that it feels like you're seriously missing out if you don't buy one of 'm.
Assuming that Arm-powered Linux devices aren't 'ready' for your workloads, we're left with the latest by AMD and Intel.
However, it's noteworthy to mention that these aren't provided by traditionally Linux-first vendors like NovaCustom, System76, Star Labs or TUXEDO computers yet.
Heck, these are currently only found on laptops by ASUS, HP, Lenovo and MSI. And from within their offerings, none are sold with Linux OOTB yet. This isn't important for easy install (as I've yet to find one bundled with EndeavourOS anyways), but it is for proper Linux support so early into its lifecycle.
So, quite frankly, I'd suggest you to abstain from buying a device right now as it might lead to buyer's remorse. Instead, consider buying one at next year's Black Friday.
However, if you truly need one device right now, then I'd stick to one sold with an AMD Zen 4 processor. Furthermore, either ensure that the device is sold with Linux OOTB, or check out its ArchWiki entry to see how well-documented it is and buy accordingly.
For specific device recommendations, you seem to be particularly interested in making use of Black Friday deals, and thus I'd assume that price is an important factor. Unfortunately, most Linux-first vendors aren't particularly known for offering great buck for your money. This does make it easier to choose, though.
Taking all of the above into consideration, we actually arrive -perhaps unsurprisingly- at Lenovo's Thinkpad line of devices with AMD's Zen 4 processors.
For specific device recommendations, you seem to be particularly interested in making use of Black Friday deals, and thus I’d assume that price is an important factor. Unfortunately, most Linux-first vendors aren’t particularly known for offering great buck for your money. This does make it easier to choose, though.
Sadly yes, budget is important, additionally System76/Framework are out as they don't ship to my location and are quite out of my budget unfortunately and I'd rather not use a shipping agent. Given all the advice that's been given I think the points everyone has made are especially valid and I should wait until more funds are available and purchase a more suitable laptop.
I'm looking at slimbook as they can deliver with EndeavourOS OOB but still will be a harder delivery option but also have more budget options.
I find that Dell is very Linux friendly, some of them even comes with Ubuntu installed and supported on them.
You can find a slightly used one for a few hundreds $, and they are easy to upgrade, repair, etc, buy a Precision or Latitude that is coming from a company replacing them after 3 years.
I mained a 3420 latitude with a 1135g7. Probably my favorite experience I've had. No complaints what so ever. Battery life was 2-4 hours
I have a Dell Latitude now and it's been great running EndeavourOS but has now developed a hardware issue so I'm searching black Friday for a replacement.
From my experience MSI has been solid. Changed the battery once in 6 years of ownership. Others have had shitty times with hinges and such. However I have an nvidia version and although I don't struggle with things, VMware hates nvidia and needs the integrated Intel GPU. I use Mint btw.