Guti: "It was the throne of Vinicius, Mbappé, Haaland... But Bellingham is the only one who has realized that the throne of Messi and Cristiano is free... and he is going for it."
Guti: "It was the throne of Vinicius, Mbappé, Haaland... But Bellingham is the only one who has realized that the throne of Messi and Cristiano is free... and he is going for it."
Guti (Jos� Mar�a Guti�rrez), habl� de Bellingham y Luis Enrique en el programa 'El Chiringuito' que presenta Josep Pedrerol. El exfutbolista de 46 a�os, que jug� de 1995 a 2010 en
r/soccercirclejerk
Imagine thinking a Brazilian would get this dickridding after so little, lol. Vini won an UCL with a goal in the final, slapped everyone around for a full season, was recognized by some in the sport as top 3 in the world, and... Was left behind Declan Rice and 9 other players in the "the best" shortlist. Only a few select countries get this media attention
Ok, thiccnick.
Workrate doesn't equal quality, tho and Madrid fans(and tbf, many others), were uncontrollably hyping him beyond belief
literally none of them are going to reach the level of messi and ronaldo. if any of them somehow manage to do that, we won't know for many, many years because the thing that made messi and ronaldo so incredible is their longevity at the top. I know it's natural to wanna fill in the space that messi and ronaldo will be leaving but we're probably gonna be entering an era of many great players being simultaneously recognised rather than the freak chance that we had where there were somehow two footballing gods existing at once.
I think Mbappes final is extremely overrated tbh
It was meant to be a joke. I’ve been having fun this whole thread but now the vibe has changed and I need to sleep. Oh well.
Fr
mate staunch was created to describre Rangers FC and its fans what are you on about?
Australia. Don't know why. Just feels right.
Nobody is comparing him to Ronaldo & Messi. They’re saying he is the next in line. You can be the best in the world for a period of time without being as good as the two best to ever grace the sport.
If you are playing for Real Madrid you need to be ready to handle the pressure and the expectations tho
Love bellingham, but this is a bit too much
Her approach to away games is reminiscent of Genghis Khan
Some jokes don’t hit, it is what it is.
Edited:
Ipswich are already too massive mate we don't need Bellingham.
Madrid fans hype and put down their players so much.
You’re just a Busquets/Rodri style hater. Discrimination against DMs
I wonder what this country would be like if we ever actually had a messi level talent lmao.
Foreign countries rating an English player is always nice
Messi is the last The Best winner and current front runner for the Ballon d'Or. It's fair to say he has not left his throne yet.
You're thinking of the gudgeon, the staunch connects the pachyderm to the cabotage.
Will have a listen, thanks!
Julian literally creates so many chances, pretty sure he has created the most chances in the top 5 leagues.
He's the one who's been the main driving force in the attack by far.
He has been the most creative.
He has been the one who's been so efficient in terms of scoring too.
Tell me a player who is better, and tell me why.
lmao cmon guys 10 games and hes already ballon dor
Bellingham is incredible, so mature and incredible player. Poised to become one of the best
English players. This sub did the same to rashford last year, people were arguing that he was a better winger than Vini
Has anyones dick ever been ridden this hard within a fraction of the season? Jude is amazing, a top player with a great sense for goal. But who would actually call him the best in the world? Nobody that is being serious. Amazing start but the season is young. If he can keep up the goalscoring from the midfield then I’ll be ready to consider it. If we go by goalscoring then Guirassy is the best in the world.
I would agree if the final hadn't gone like it did. Unfortunately Griezmann didn't have a great game
But has he won the world cup??
Oh wait..
What did you execpt from guti lmao. His modric takes are all you need to read to disregard this dude forever
Meanwhile Messi going for another balloon d or
I love soccer and what it means to the fans but I just can’t stand soccer media. It’s to me the worse of them all. The sources suck, the stories are so emotional, and seldom any anaysis.
you're missing the 'staunch madridista' which takes it to a level above
At this point we should just burn it down and rebuild
He is a midfielder with a lot of freedom to go high up the pitch, but make no mistake, he still very much plays as a midfielder.
She just realized it was the throne of Vinicius, Mbappé, Haaland... But Islacker is the only one who has realized that the throne of Messi and Cristiano is free... and she is going for it.
exactly, just wait until madrid buy a proper CF next summer and his hype and goal contributuin die down
I've been rooting for him so much.
This is the case for r/soccer Americans, yes
Okay let’s all calm down
The truth will set you free
Madrid PR is crazy😭😭😭
Tf are you guys on about, like be serious for once. Bellingham is not going to replace Messi and Ronaldo.
we certainly will
just not anytime soon
Please let the man grow naturaly
Don't set him up to fail when you compare him with messi and cristiano
I googled it and can’t find 30 in 5. Seen 8 in 21
Oh well I do both, clearly. Are you French? (I do get called a yank for sensible comments all the time to be fair).
You're a Madrid supporter and never watched El Clasico?
Haaland is better, they are teammates. 8G 1A in 8 games, Alvarez 3G 4A. And Haaland is on his worst spell since leaving Norway in 2019. If you got the FPL app you can look up the stats of strikers in general etc. If we talk about just recent weeks, I would say Watkins is the standout. Alvarez isn’t topping any stats in the prem as of now.
Compared to Messi and Ronaldo, he's on the level of Steven Gerrard or maybe Francesco Totti. He's good but definitely second-tier.
why does this have 2k upvotes? this means basically nothing
Hell I'd say Mbappe had a better world cup individually than Messi. France genuinely looked toothless every time without him on the pitch, he was carrying that attack HARD, with maybe Griezmann as the only exception.
Messi did well too, but they had a bunch of guys who stood up when it mattered, like Enzo, Alvarez, Di Maria etc.
Recency bias is unreal
No way man. Alvarez is good but he’s not even a top 5 prem player atm.
Jesus Christ. Bellingham dick riding is unreal. Even guti has become deluded. A few more months of this nonstop dick riding and people are gonna start hating him even though he's done nothing to deserve it.
You know, you can just recognize that Bellingham is playing at a high level because he's good and fits the system at Real well and because he has good players around him. You don't have to make up deranged theories of how only he recognizes that there is some kind of empty throne and that, presumably, Haaland and Mbappe could just chose to play better, but don't ... because they think Messi and Ronaldo are still in this throne. What a bunch of nonsense.
I dont see it
Alvarez has been very good, but not head and shoulders above his teammates and opponents, just like Bellingham has been in La Liga & the two UCL games so far.
Statistically Bellingham has 13 G&A in 10 games, Alvarez has 11 G&A in 13 (Transfermarkt). Also Bellingham is better than pretty much every other area of the game (passing, duels etc) and according to WhoScored he averages a 8.26 rating in La Liga, while Alvarez is on a 7.32 in EPL. Bellingham has 6 MOTM awards, while Alvarez has only one, against Red Star in UCL.
So yeah, I think Bellingham has been better by any means.
after not getting much game time at Spurs, and fighting for minutes at Fulham, I'm just glad Carlos Vinicius is finally getting the recognition he deserves.
If you say that Mbappe will score in the final of 2026, I'll buy that first than Bellingham.
Man, France really looks strong already.
Ah yes, the originators of the language haven’t learnt the word ‘staunch’ - a word that originates from the early 17th century in England at a time when the number of English speakers in what would be America numbered in the mere thousands and hadn’t yet developed a distinct dialect
What a strange take
Bro’s just in form while Haaland and Mbappe coincidentally are having a dip in form and people are alr claiming he’s the next GOAT lmfao bunch of sheeps
Madrid, Barcelona and Bayern are probably the 3 biggest clubs in the world
Love how italian clubs just dont exist.
Pfft yea, who's this Haaland guy anyway huh?
There is no fact about it mate.
I mean that’s also probably why the EPL doesn’t care, they are very reluctant to give it to an EPL player even when they deserve it.
See: Henry, Thierry as well as any Liverpool player 2019.
The best players in the world generally don’t want to come to England. They want Bayern, Barcelona, or Madrid.
Haaland is the only real superstar signing, anyone else had to develop in England to get ranked as a top 10 player.
r/cringequotes
This is the cringiest fuckin quote ever lmao
Jude has been phenomenal, and i truly believe he is special. But hold your god damn horses Guti💀
Honestly most of the time, the other countries and Europe are worse for this than the Americans. Which is a sentence I never thought I’d say.
Wut how? Hes not even close to that level.
People have fully lost the plot with Messi comparisons
It's like they already forgot what prime Messi was capable of
There's not a single player in the world that back then and right now rivaled the quality of his first touch + dribble + passing + ball control + balance/agility/strength + vision + runs + pressing (yes prime Messi used to press, defend, track back and not just walk around) + assists + goals
Even if someone surpasses his goals and assists they'll still have a tough time also rivalling the quality of his passing/touches/ball controll/dribbling. Haaland for example COULD rival/surpass his amount of goals. Assists and all those attributes? Nope. Same with Mbappé, same with Vini, same with Bellingham.
Messi also did it from the 2000s all the way into the 2020s. In 2009 I was saying ''if he could keep this up for at least 4 years he's without a doubt the best ever. Look at us now. He went above and beyond. I swear a lot of people have really already forgotten what it was like pre-Messi. If a striker had a few seasons where he touched 30 goals people were praising them like crazy. Then Messi came around and ''merely'' scoring that amount would make him into a failure. It's like Messi's previous season where he played more like a playmaker and still scored 16 goals and gave 16 assists in Ligue 1. If Zidane used to have a season like that it would be seen as something incredible. While for him it's been called a failure lol.
I mean, ngl, I kinda want somebody other than Mbappe or Haaland to win the BdO before either of them does, mainly for the memes that would come afterwards. Bellingham is certainly one of those who does stand a chance.
Yet the Bellingham dick riding by all sorts of media there is right now can make any sentient human being die from cringe.
How does him scoring free-kick, and few amazing long shot goals needed help from Haaland.
And Haaland also score due to team contribution. Recently he is missing chances or not even getting chances in some of the matches does not mean he is playing shit.
"But his reign only lasted until Mathys Tel started playing full games. And the world changed forever."
remember when people were doing this for valverde after he had 5 good games
How do you select the best player in Europe?
He fits the criteria based on this season so far.
Lol, this man must smoke 20g of weed a day.
I mean Messi will still have the throne as long as he's still on the FIFA gravy train.
Not sure if this is just him in incredible form and if this kind of goal contribution is sustainable or not, but if he indeed manages to sustain it to some extent then he could have a real shot at Bdo, especially considering he can contribute a lot for England in Euros.
It would be very very funny if he wins bdo as a RMA player before Mbappe. A man can dream
He used "Throne" singular. Did Messi sit on CR7's lap or was it vice-versa?
9 (nine) games into the La Liga season. Always a circus
Basically the Spanish fulfilling the story of Fox and the sour grapes, after losing Mbappe and Haaland to the Arabs and realising that both r probably never gonna come.
Bellingham is the leftover, who is turning out to be real good, but he need to keep up the performances for a couple of seasons before he can compared to Mbappe and Haaland.
After that we can talk about comparison to the best who ever played football.
He is.
Highest chances created in all of Europe.
Highest G/A in UCL and he played 1 full game, and 11 minutes in the 2nd game.
Higher G/A than Mbappe and Haaland in all competitions. Mbappe even plays in a farmer's league and is still struggling.
Pretty sure he has higher G/A than Bellingham, either higher or slightly lower. Alvarez has a similar output while playing in a tougher league, and also vastly outperforms Bellingham in creating chances.
Who is better than Alvarez this season?
Southgate needs to drop Kane. This guy needs to play as a striker/false striker.
I checked the stats.
Bellingham has 2 higher G/A. The apps are 13 for Alvarez and 10 for Bellingham, but the actual time played is not that different, not even 1 full game different. So basically the same apps with Bellingham have 2 higher G/A.
This is with Alvarez playing in a much harder league.
Plus, Alvarez had the highest chances created in top 5 leagues with another guy.
Also, Alvarez has higher UCL G/A.
So yes, Alvarez does have slightly less G/A but he's I still believe he's the better player cause of the reasons mentioned.
Fuck off. He's so far away from matching the goal tally and trophy count of Halland.
It's literally a 2 G/A difference in all competitions with basically the same gametime (Alvarez has slightly more, not even 1 full game).
Alvarez plays in a tougher league bro. Scoring in the PL is harder. Be serious. The quality in the prem is easily higher.
Jude has a slightly higher G/A. Plays in a weaker league. Creates less chances (Alvarez has the highest in Europe along with some other dude). Is fantastic at pressing. Is basically the entire creative engine for City these days.
I've seen both of them, and I can safely say that Alvarez is better. I'm not worried about Bellingham.
I mean, we are literally talking about right now. Tf you think that means. Why would you look at last season when talking about NOW?
Haaland was the best last season, he very evidently isn't right now.
It's also been like 2 months since the season started. It's not like we're doing this within a week. Lmao.
Fucking hell, we’re only in October.
If he was playing for us and you, everyone would be calling him best in the world.
Mbappe single-handedly took france to the penalties in the world cup final
pffft
"exciting time" I don't think anything will be more exciting than Messi and ronaldo scoring 150+goals between them in one year.
Better yet, they even played eachother 2-3 time every season.
Like 4 of them are in that madrid 2 games, missed 3 in a aingle game
No way is Bellingham better than current Messi, the difference in footballing IQ and techical skills are vast.
Bellingham is running the la Liga. Fair play. Don't get me wrong Haaland is a beast, but Bellingham is probably the best player on the planet right now.
I imagine Haaland goes to Madrid soon, RM looking tasty and need a striker.
I'm pretty sure Haaland is going for it
Agreed, I mean I don’t even think Haaland has even had a performance that has reached Mbappe’s World Cup Final hat trick (even if 2/3 goals are penalties) considering this guy has 0 goals OR assists in 8 Semis/Finals for City lmao. Put Haaland in Mbappe’s position and the Final would’ve been lost before Extra Time
Damn Benzima didn’t get named
Huge difference there…
This saying is just comical
Thanks for posting that, mate.
Sorry but the whole throne analogy makes no sense 😂
I was talking about in comparison to Kane...obviously. They've only played in the same league for the one season. Suppose we can also use this season as a barometer also when it's done, meanwhile Kane scoring there at better than a goal a game already despite Bayern being off it.
Haaland scored 72% of his goals last year against the bottom half. So, yes, a flat track bully.
Happy to leave it there mate as the stats back me up! Of course he'll score in big games too. He's a very good player. But he's not going to go down as one of the best footballers of all time, because he just isn't, and he's not even better than Harry Kane, who also probably won't go down as one.
In my opinion Julian Alvarez is the best player in the Europe right now then Haaland and Mbappe, then maybe Bellingham. Vinicius this season had injury so he didn't play enough to say that he's in top 10.
Jude Bellingham has became really overrated
English tax is really real
People are so reactionary. To even ASPIRE to that throne you need like 5 insane seasons in the bag.
Christ's sake...I am a staunch Madridista, but aren't we getting the bubble bigger and bigger and it's only October! What if he dissapears in the middle of the season? Don't feed the hype...
This right here is how so many Madrid players have won Ballon Dors, yes they have all been incredible players but backed by incredible PR and at the end of the day, the ballon Dor is a PR exercise.
This right here is how so many Madrid players have won Ballon Dors, yes they have all been incredible players but backed by incredible PR and at the end of the day, the ballon Dor is a PR exercise.
Uh huh, there’s a long way for this kid to go if he intends to occupy the mantle of Messi and Ronaldo - both of whom undoubtedly were terrific at this age. Well ffs stop the freaking “throne” concept. The PR is getting overwhelming and I hope it doesn’t get into that kid’s head.
It's simple resonance boys, "Hala Madrid" + "It's coming home".
I think its just going to be a far more open playing field in the future. Its unlikely we will ever see such dominance like Messi and Ronaldo again. Its an exciting time for a football fan to watch how these young players develop and how the landscape of the Ballon dOr changes.
This is the yearly Real Madrid's campaign to claim ballon d'or to themselves. Nothing new, will happen again next season with [insert madrid player here]
who put vinicius in the mbappe haaland convos????
People are so reactionary. To even ASPIRE to that throne you need like 5 insane seasons in the bag.
Are people actually comparing this dude to Ronaldo and Messi? Da fuk?
Musiala will be the king
Guti is a legend for us, but I don't understand this "throne" thing. I've seen other people saying things like "Bellingham is gonna dethrone Haaland and Mbappe". The current Ballon d'Or holder is still Benzema, the current FIFA The best award belongs to Messi. Vinicius, Mbappe and Haaland have never been the best players in the world yet and as for Bellingham, he's close, but it's too soon to say.
Even if Haaland wins the Ballon d'Or ahead of Messi, Mbappe will most likely barely finish in the top 5 and that's mainly because of his WC final performance and his overall popularity.
I think its just going to be a far more open playing field in the future. Its unlikely we will ever see such dominance like Messi and Ronaldo again. Its an exciting time for a football fan to watch how these young players develop and how the landscape of the Ballon dOr changes.
Uh huh, there’s a long way for this kid to go if he intends to occupy the mantle of Messi and Ronaldo - both of whom undoubtedly were terrific at this age. Well ffs stop the freaking “throne” concept. The PR is getting overwhelming and I hope it doesn’t get into that kid’s head.
It's simple resonance boys, "Hala Madrid" + "It's coming home".
That quote doesn't make any sense.
Jude Bellingham is English.
That's the comment.
In my opinion Julian Alvarez is the best player in the Europe right now then Haaland and Mbappe, then maybe Bellingham. Vinicius this season had injury so he didn't play enough to say that he's in top 10.
It's odd how much the Spanish care about the Balon d'Or vs how little the English care.
La Liga seems to have an obsession of signing the best in the world whereas England don't despite clearly having the money to do it.
On one hand I'd like to see the best players in the world come to England but on the other hand, fuck the English clubs that could afford them.
I suppose Barcelona and Real Madrid are the full package and I don't think there's a club in England that can compete with them.
Bellingham has started hitting haaland level......a season later.
Same guy that said Modric isn't good enough for RM.
Haaland scores a shit load of goals and wins a treble and that’s not going for it lol
You all should calm down lol
He is a fucking midfielder. His every goal will be cheered because RM don’t have a proper worldclass CF.
There will come a time when Jude won’t be able to score and lets hope then this same media wont take him down the drain of criticism.
Meanwhile you have guys like Guti hyping him up ridiculously and unnecessarily.
Everyone sane knows how important Jude is.
Wowow I like Jude but come on man...
Next Ronny/Messi? You have to be kidding me. This is just wank at this point nobody not even Jude believes he is the next Messiah, chosen to lead England to the WC or some other bullshits.
He looks great but some of the coverage is really over the top. I especially hope it isn't as harsh as it is postive now if he has a bad patch.
Fair enough
Henry wasn't ever there best player in the world
Try not to overhype someone challenge
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I completely agree. But if they are saying "Messi/Cristiano's throne" then they are comparing them to the goats themselves.
especially in modern football where tactics and teams factors heavily into how well you play. I don't think Jude would score this much in another team with a proper striker like Kane.
I think it’s perfectly fine to gush over Bellingham. He’s young, ambitious, chose Madrid and is delivering. Is it a little bit horse before the cart? Yes. But the void left by messi and Ronaldo, and the smaller voids left by star like Neymar and the other stars of Europe will need to be filled by this u25 generation. We are entering a period where it seems like the 2000s where like the ballon dor could be won by like 5-6 players in the next 10 years.
she slaps the fuck out of you
Or fucks the slap out of him
*Fucks the clap out of him.
Mbappe will most likely barely finish in the top 5 and that's mainly because of his WC final performance and his overall popularity.
That is so blatantly false, did you not watch the rest of his games during the WC? He didn't win the golden boot just based on that one game.
Tbh I always saw your club BVB like NXT in WWE. In WWE NXT is a developmental brand where wrestlers go to develop before moving on to Raw or Smackdown. Sometimes the brand does really well that it is the highlight of WWE but it is usually always seen as a place where people develop to go for bigger things.
BVB attracts so many good young prospects that end up having big careers in football but most of them never stay at BVB and instead use it to springboard for a much bigger club. I think if BVB wants to raise the ceiling they need to make it attractive for players to stay and not see it as a springboard but instead a club they can win titles in.
I don’t know what the obsession with Haaland is on this sub
Something about him scoring a fuckload of goals? What a dumb statement lol.
He’s not the unanimous best player.
He is definitely in contention for Best in the world right now and more than just a great player. But it makes no sense to talk about Messi and Ronaldo as they are a whole level above, in the GOAT contention. We won't be seeing anything at their level for a while, let alone two at the same time.
Haaland has at best a shot at turning into one of the GOATs classic 9s, but I don't see he becoming a complete footballer in the likes of Messi and Ronaldo.
He did score 36 goals in the Prem. That’s the obsession.
Nobody’s saying he’s the complete player. But he’s astonishingly good, in a very prominent way (scores goals), so people obsess over him. No surprise.
I mean, a similar thing can be said about Bellingham.
Scoring goals is the hardest job in football. Just ask my team :3
The whole thing is so dumb. Everybody knows that theoretical throne is open but the two of them reached arguably the highest individual levels that any player has ever hit and maintained it there or abouts for a good 10 years.
You can’t realise something and suddenly hit the levels of the greatest players of all time, they are all obviously trying to reach that but if you could do it by just wanting to then I’m sure we wouldn’t have had to wait 30/50 years to find people capable of competing with pele and Maradona for the title of the best to ever do it.
Never change football. I bet 4 months from now we get headlines such as "Bellingham is an overrated flop" when he goes through a small dip.
It's only appreciated if he continues to back it up. The Bernabeu has even whistled Ronaldo...
We will see how he does, but showing up for big games is important (Mbappe did for two WCs). But he has plenty of time to cement a solid legacy IMO.
#claimofthrones was right there
Some groups, but not necessarily all... CR7 is really loved even though he left when still under contract clearly to outrun his tax issues. Owen and Becks weren't hated even when things soured.
Bale and Hazard are particularly awful cases for sure though.
I dunno...people who watch football? Look at any list of the top players of all time and find the highest one that wasn't technically fantastic. People don't revere only great goalscoring, but great footballers. Pele, R9, Cruyff, Maradona...
Many players have scored a lot of goals. Haaland isn't even as good as Harry Kane at his own job, and Kane does far more besides. He's got a long way to go to be in any conversation as one of the greats.
And the all time English record is held by Greaves. Don’t be pedantic, you knew they meant season.
Shutup and stop putting pressure on these youngsters.
Scoring goals is the hardest job in football. Just ask my team :3
How do you know that? Watkins isn’t playing in the UCL so you can’t compare it. But if that’s what we go by, Haaland is superior to Alvarez and all others.
0 goals and assists in 7 semi finals and finals for city last season.
9 big chances missed tho
I don't think stones was an lb last season
bro do you not know Madrid media?
Can't wait for the Bellingham Netfilx special in 20 years time
Yeah for sure but neither is what Bellingham has done for Madrid
My comment is not really about the idea he can’t have a bad game, it’s whether his skillset allows him to holistically, consistently impact the full game in the way the absolute best do.
You are selling CR7 short. Some of Cristiano's performances in knockout rounds of CLs in threepeat are stuff of almost unattainable legend. If Haaland can come close to that, hats truly off. But I doubt that he will.
But they didn’t stay which is proving my point
I mean, a similar thing can be said about Bellingham.
He’s not the unanimous best player.
Why scotland?
I mean, you can argue that Klose was probably one of the best in positioning.
He was always in the right place at the opportune time. That is a skill by itself.
Ronaldo was the best striker with great physicality and great finishing, while Klose was the kind of player that would get you those goals on silly bounces or long crosses.
Smartest player if he gets away with it. Shows up to big games with goals from DM too. For me the best player city have ever had
Yeah it’s quite a difficult situation for Dortmund. Winning last year or anything in general and regularly would help tremendously. The Ruhr Region is a big push factor for players as well. Paying higher wages is untenable and could mean financial suicide so I understand Watzke and co. A real golden generation of homegrown talent seems like the most probable push for Dortmund imo
Haaland claim the throne #VikingStyle
Yanks get called yanks when they say stupid yanks shit. Not when they say something sensible.
a Liga seems to have an obsession of signing the best in the world whereas England don't despite clearly having the money to do it.
Meanwhile english clubs spend 100m on Mudryk, 115 on Caicedo and 105 on Declan Rice.
This guy isn't going to score 40 goals a year. Goals take the throne.
Mbappe is stuck on a crap team, he has his choosing of teams next year and haaland at the moment is quite absent in big games.
You mean those goals that count towards the scoreline?
Nah, Haaland is most definitely a better finisher, but Kane is just a far better all-around player
Do you feel Haaland’s contribution when he isn’t scoring is equivalent to those two players?
That almost started after the Atlético game. People will bring up again the Bild article about how his Dortmund teammates hated him.
He just exposed the ceiling of your club
It sounds kind of rude but it's the truth and realising the ceiling is the first step to push beyond it.
I'm not entirely sure if the club wants to realise this too though, the last transfer window was far from convincing.
Feels more like settling to me but it can be kind of disheartening when it happens every other season.
Like how do you make the Ruhrpott attractive to star players when they dont 100% identify with the mentality and the people there knowing that you can pay well but you cant pay Man City/Real Madrid well, knowing you're able to compete for most titles but chances of winning are a different story?
On top of that individual ambitions will always be better realised at the behemoth clubs like chance for ballon d'or, individual sponsoring and contracts etc
Then there is the lifestyle and glamour factor too which you also cant ignore, especially when there is partners or family involved.
Yeah it’s quite a difficult situation for Dortmund. Winning last year or anything in general and regularly would help tremendously. The Ruhr Region is a big push factor for players as well. Paying higher wages is untenable and could mean financial suicide so I understand Watzke and co. A real golden generation of homegrown talent seems like the most probable push for Dortmund imo
Tbh I always saw your club BVB like NXT in WWE. In WWE NXT is a developmental brand where wrestlers go to develop before moving on to Raw or Smackdown. Sometimes the brand does really well that it is the highlight of WWE but it is usually always seen as a place where people develop to go for bigger things.
BVB attracts so many good young prospects that end up having big careers in football but most of them never stay at BVB and instead use it to springboard for a much bigger club. I think if BVB wants to raise the ceiling they need to make it attractive for players to stay and not see it as a springboard but instead a club they can win titles in.
my guy it's only October the season has just started.
You need to be able to do a bit more at the end of the day if you want to be regarded in such circles
Says who? There's no one in the world better at Haalands role.
Why is Haaland expected to dribble on the halfway line and play make, but Vinicius, Bellingham and others aren't expected to score 60 goals + go for another treble
Then what do you think he means by "Bellingham is the only one who has realized that the throne of Messi and Cristiano is free"?
He lost two finals against the guy and he's still mad
Guti with the back pass
messi, ronaldo and even mbappe showed us a lot of solo goals either dribbling 1 or 2 players, free kicks or long shots goals. have ever haaland showed us goals like this ? if not, then he shouldn't be mentioned as best player .
Just don't let one rip please
Thats such a stupid argument. Dortmund have less quality than other top sides, and when they get top quality they dont have quite the resources to hold onto it. Simple as that. Nothing to do with ambition
An eu4 meme? In my good sports subreddit?
I thought Shearer had 34 in a 42 game season? Same as Andy Cole. Whereas Haaland 36 in a 38 game season?
Dixie Dean, Jimmy Greaves, and whole bunch of other players still scored more than all of them - but most of those records are from the 1920s and the game was presumably a bit different then.
Good thing Haaland didn't break the all time goal scoring record in the Premiere League and won the treble last season otherwise people would be thinking he's going for the "empty throne"
Jesus Christ
Yeah dude Vinicious, Mbappe and Haaland have fallen off a cliff these past few... days
The whole thing is so dumb. Everybody knows that theoretical throne is open but the two of them reached arguably the highest individual levels that any player has ever hit and maintained it there or abouts for a good 10 years.
You can’t realise something and suddenly hit the levels of the greatest players of all time, they are all obviously trying to reach that but if you could do it by just wanting to then I’m sure we wouldn’t have had to wait 30/50 years to find people capable of competing with pele and Maradona for the title of the best to ever do it.
Confirmed, Vincent Tan is bringing back the red and black and signing Bellingham to Cardiff City.
Bild also read heavily into this tbh, they make biased connections they want to have.
They see Bellingham going to the fans alone after a match and make it about him being selfish because Haaland was really popular but we have no right to attribute this to a characteristic of his.
I dont want to blame him for soaking up that atmosphere alone and it wasnt every time tbh.
Same way Bild attributed Adeyemis dip in form to his new girlfriend.
They spin stories and are biased as fuck.
The only other example is when he dissed Schulz but here im biased because im all for "pregnant wife beater" slander.
And Bellingham wants straight to the top of football, same as Haaland.
It's not like they left us for sidegrades, they simply outgrew us and when they do, there is like 3-4 clubs to go to.
There is no shame in admitting that.
We molded two of the best players on the planet and have molded a couple of them in the past.
Im not saying he didnt outgrew us as a club. Im saying the idea that he outgrow the ambitions of the rest of the squad, as if they dont wanna be the best or whatever is baseless and odd to say tbh.
Bild also isnt known to be wellconnected to us.
Thats not to say I dont believe that Bellingham possibly had issues etc, but historically it should be pointed out that Bild is a wack source for us and our internal ongoings.
The fact that you mention that Bild also attributed adeyemis dip in form to his new girlfriend proves my point about their habit of conjecture. Its literally an incel angle that is dumb as shit. It can only be attributed to Adeyemi.. not his girlfriend. Its HIS responsibility to balance worklife and private life. HIS responsibility to remain focused and perform. Even if she's a controversial high profile person, its HIM that thats responsible for his dip in form and should be attributed for the dip in form.
Bild is a gossip-mag in both these cases, objectively speaking.
Im not disagreeing with Jude outgrowing us or the possibility that some of his antics might have annoyed others in the team.
I don’t know what the obsession with Haaland is on this sub. Great player but theymre really trying to force this unanimous best in the world
Yeah dude Vinicious, Mbappe and Haaland have fallen off a cliff these past few... days
Haaland can maybe reach R9 levels of scoring skill.
But he doesn't really have the chance creation that CR7 did have. And well, no one will ever match Messi in being able to create goals out of thin air.
It sounds kind of rude but it's the truth and realising the ceiling is the first step to push beyond it.
I'm not entirely sure if the club wants to realise this too though, the last transfer window was far from convincing.
Feels more like settling to me but it can be kind of disheartening when it happens every other season.
Like how do you make the Ruhrpott attractive to star players when they dont 100% identify with the mentality and the people there knowing that you can pay well but you cant pay Man City/Real Madrid well, knowing you're able to compete for most titles but chances of winning are a different story?
On top of that individual ambitions will always be better realised at the behemoth clubs like chance for ballon d'or, individual sponsoring and contracts etc
Then there is the lifestyle and glamour factor too which you also cant ignore, especially when there is partners or family involved.
Yeah it’s quite a difficult situation for Dortmund. Winning last year or anything in general and regularly would help tremendously. The Ruhr Region is a big push factor for players as well. Paying higher wages is untenable and could mean financial suicide so I understand Watzke and co. A real golden generation of homegrown talent seems like the most probable push for Dortmund imo
Tbh I always saw your club BVB like NXT in WWE. In WWE NXT is a developmental brand where wrestlers go to develop before moving on to Raw or Smackdown. Sometimes the brand does really well that it is the highlight of WWE but it is usually always seen as a place where people develop to go for bigger things.
BVB attracts so many good young prospects that end up having big careers in football but most of them never stay at BVB and instead use it to springboard for a much bigger club. I think if BVB wants to raise the ceiling they need to make it attractive for players to stay and not see it as a springboard but instead a club they can win titles in.
Based on his...one season? The season in which Kane set the record for number of different games scored in, in a shite Tottenham side, after smashing it for years anyway. Gimme a break.
He's a flat track bully that loves to put them away from 6 yards.
Many people, smart people, are saying this.
Glazing
Mbappe dropped 0.02 xG vs Newcastle as well but all people talk about is haaland
Again. That's why I put 'midfielder'
Mbappe has a world cup, Haaland has won a treble and broke the PL goal scoring record. Think the hype gas gone overboard in record time
What titles? Guirassy has "dethroned" Mbappe and Haaland this season going by your logic.
Im not saying he didnt outgrew us as a club. Im saying the idea that he outgrow the ambitions of the rest of the squad, as if they dont wanna be the best or whatever is baseless and odd to say tbh.
Bild also isnt known to be wellconnected to us.
Thats not to say I dont believe that Bellingham possibly had issues etc, but historically it should be pointed out that Bild is a wack source for us and our internal ongoings.
The fact that you mention that Bild also attributed adeyemis dip in form to his new girlfriend proves my point about their habit of conjecture. Its literally an incel angle that is dumb as shit. It can only be attributed to Adeyemi.. not his girlfriend. Its HIS responsibility to balance worklife and private life. HIS responsibility to remain focused and perform. Even if she's a controversial high profile person, its HIM that thats responsible for his dip in form and should be attributed for the dip in form.
Bild is a gossip-mag in both these cases, objectively speaking.
Im not disagreeing with Jude outgrowing us or the possibility that some of his antics might have annoyed others in the team.
He is an incredibly good scorer. It's the kind of player that changes a game.
It's why everyone puts Ronaldo Fenomeno in their XI, because he was the best finisher, you could count on him turning a game with his physicality and finishing.
CR7 and Messi are outliers and people should remember that. Only two players in all history have been that gamebreaking.
According to Google Shearer had 31 🤔
Real England?
Which coincedentally is the same place Arsenal's title challenge fell off last season.
Yeah definitely, although you are comparing his first season in a top level team (no offense Dortmund lol) to the best numbers Messi and Ronaldo ever put up.
We would need to talk about this matter in like 7 years or so.
No shit
You need to be able to do a bit more at the end of the day if you want to be regarded in such circles
Agreed. I think he's the best at what he does. Devastating even. But the goat of goats all have more aspects to their game than he currently does.
Haaland couldn't lace Ronaldo Fenomeno's boots, which is sort of what I'm getting at. He had so much about him apart from being a finisher, and it's those skills that set apart Haaland from the best.
Just my opinion, but I don't see him reaching Ronaldo's level.
Purely from a numbers and statistics perspective he might, but there's something about the goats of the game that make you believe anything is possible when they're around. Ronaldo was capable of making something happen out of nothing, whether he got service or not. Until now, I don't think the same can be said about Haaland. I've got nothing tangible to back this up of course, just my thoughts. As for Messi, well yeh that's not a discussion.
I mean, I've watched some disastrous games from both Messi and Cr7, it's not like every single one of their +900 games has been a 10/10
This being said, and it might sound controversial I know, but I believe Haaland could reach Ronaldos level, he's already a world class finisher, is good in the air and has crazy top speed, only thing he lacks in comparison might be the dribbling alltough he doesn't really needs that when bulldozering through the defenders does the trick. This being said, he's still so young, maybe he develops some crazy techniques too. His biggest challange in this case would be to keep up with the numbers for 15+ seasons, but who's to say he can't do that.
Messis level on the other hand, is unreachable, for any human being. And every comparison between the two would just be unfair and not make much sense.
We can just let it be gay, it’s 2023 and we’re not in Saudi Arabia
I mean he won the UCL
How can they slap???
I worded incorrectly, should've added that I mean goals scored in a season
Even though anyone who has a bit of logic know I obviously did not mean that he suddenly became the all time leading goalscorer
Because Real Madrid literally showed in practice that whenever they pay tens of millions for a Brazilian kid, there is a high chance that it was a good deal. Neymar, Vini, Rodrigo and Marcelo had to prove this on the pitch, all being vital in UCL wins, objectively undeniable success. Others get much more praise with way less done. It extends beyond the guys I mentioned - just compare how much attention is given to Alisson or Ederson relative to Ter Steven or Courtois, too. Alisson, like Vini, was snubbed from being in the list of the best keeper; Casemiro and Thiago Silva had to move to England in their 30s to start being seen after very successful careers. Can you imagine the attention that an English kid would get for doing this and what rodrygo did to city?
The guy is more of a midfielder than say de bruyne. Bellingham plays the whole pitch, total football incarnate
Nah he’s Joseph Smith
They were calling him a top 3 mid in the world and a legit Balon contender tho.
It's crazy that Vini is being considered up there with Haaland and Mbappe. Neymar was the twice the player at the same age.
There will come a time when Jude won’t be able to score
DON'T SAY THAT
My point is that both Mbappe/Haaland have never even be to "the throne" so far. You can make a strong case for Haaland during the 2022/23 season, but Mbappe? Nah.
Also nobody can deny that Bellingham has been absolutely incredible for us and he's objectively the most inform player in the world, getting MOTM awards on pretty much every single game nowadays. But, it's still early October, we'll never know what is gonna happen. There's a whole season ahead and also the Euros.
New toy in town. The Valverde of this year.
I mean, this season alone Bellingham is the best one so far. But Mbappé already proved himself in a fucking World Cup final, Vinícius Júnior proved himself in a Champions League final and Haaland broke the record for most goals in a Premier League season.
Bellingham is such a god player despite his age. I really hope the fans and critics do not demand he keep scoring this amount of goal, it's just unrealistic for a player in his position.
And it suck’s that we have the tactical genius of Southgate to utilize this potential.
He’s definitely no Kalvin Phillips!!
It's still a bit different though, Vini wasn't getting this much PR last year or the year before.
Good argument, but still someone like Benzema wasn't on Ballon d'Or level for the majority of his career, but during 2018-2021 and especially in 2021/22 he absolutely bossed it, I think he deserved to "sit in the throne", at least for one year.
Haaland might as well be there, but I could argue that Mbappe hasn't been the best French player in the WC, nor the best French player in most seasons (Benzema, Kante and Griezmann have all been better than him during 2017-2022) and in many cases not even the best PSG player (UCL 2020).
Bro he had an amazing start to his season, but come on
im legit scared that this whole bellingham hype campaign will evolve into a dele alli- esque situation
Yea but he aint gonna make the frontmen