Lemmy.world Admin Response to Defederation from Exploding Heads
Lemmy.world Admin Response to Defederation from Exploding Heads
We're closing this thread. Everything that could be said has been said. Thank you
Original Post:
Today, we want to inform everyone that we have decided to defederate from https://exploding-heads.com/. We understand that defederating should always be a last resort, and individuals can certainly block communities. However, blocking alone does not prevent potential harm to vulnerable communities.
After carefully reviewing the instance, reported posts, and multiple comments from the community, we have concluded that exploding-heads is not adhering to the Lemmy or Citizen Code of Conduct. Therefore, we cannot, in good faith, continue to federate with an instance that consistently promotes hate, racism, and bullying.
Examples:
https://lemmy.world/post/577526 - Community Moderator Harassment
https://exploding-heads.com/post/92194 - Systemadmin Post
https://exploding-heads.com/post/90780 - Systemadmin Post
https://exploding-heads.com/post/91488 - Systemadmin Post
https://exploding-heads.com/post/93725 - Community Moderator Post
Again, deciding to defederate from an instance is not taken lightly. In the future, we will continue to review instances on a case-by-case bases.
As for our community, please refrain from posting or commenting with hateful words as well. Arguing back and calling people names is not the solution. The best course of action is to report the posts or comments violating our server rules.
Lemmy Code of Conduct
https://join-lemmy.org/docs/code_of_conduct.html
Citizen Code of Conduct https://github.com/stumpsyn/policies/blob/master/citizen_code_of_conduct.md
“We are committed to providing a friendly, safe, and welcoming environment for all, regardless of level of experience, gender identity and expression, sexual orientation, disability, personal appearance, body size, race, ethnicity, age, religion, nationality, or other similar characteristic.”
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Good call! Thanks for creating a welcoming atmosphere for all!
It's weird to say that as they defederate from a community. I don't know anything about "explodingheads", but I always prefer to choose what I do and do not see.
I have no doubt that the "explodingheads" community is shitty, but I don't like the precedent of protecting me from the world on my behalf.
The Paradox of Tolerance: If everyone is tolerant of every idea, then intolerant ideas will emerge. Tolerant people will tolerate this intolerance, and the intolerant people will not tolerate the tolerant people.
To create a safe space for all ideas, the intolerant ideas cannot be tolerated
It's only a paradox if you view tolerance as an unambiguous virtue.
Tolerance is not a virtue, it is a wide armistice held to by many groups. We tolerate each other so long as the tolerance is mutual. If one side starts attacking another and does not hold to the truce, then they've forsaken it's protection. They need not be tolerated by anyone.
Yeah sure but “tolerance” and “acceptable” get redefined when it benefits only some, weird how that’s just like any other centralised social media
The paradox of tolerance is grossly misused these days to censor any opposing viewpoint, as is being done here. The entire point of free speech is the allowance of viewpoints you vehemently disagree with, and to let reason and discourse sway opinion one way or the other. Today, people only seem to invoke this to de-platform, censor, and cancel others that they don't agree with, especially in regards to the pride movement. Each individual user could be muting other users if they really can't agree or don't want to see their content, but the wholesale cutting off of communication with entire other viewpoints is very troubling. Creating "safe spaces" is not the goal of free speech. See https://fee.org/articles/why-the-paradox-of-tolerance-is-no-excuse-for-attacking-free-speech/ as a further explanation.
"The paradox of tolerance is grossly misused these days to censor any opposing viewpoint" Patently false. It is used to censor viewpoints that are intolerant. Aka hate speech.
"The entire point of free speech is the allowance of viewpoints you vehemently disagree with, and to let reason and discourse sway opinion one way or the other"
Only according to the people who think racism, bigotry, homophobia, etc., are just "opinions" that might potentially triumph in reasonable discourse. Everyone else (i.e. everyone who isn't human garbage) understands that "freedom of speech" means "not having to worry about government persecution for dissenting opinions" instead of "I should be able to say whatever I want, whenever I want to, without ever having to face any consequences".You proved his point
Lol ok. Must be fun living in a world where anything that doesn't agree with you automatically becomes proof that your position is right... because actually defending your position with reason is too difficult.
The definition of intolerance changes with time. And in time you too may find yourself defined as intollerant
It's actually suprisingly easy for most people to not be a piece of shit.
Pfft come on, you know how difficult it is. We've all been there, sitting at a blank comment section, debating what we can say that would add to the conversation, and then bam, out of nowhere, you just start uncontrollably spewing antisemitism. That's definitely how it works...
/s
Honestly, I'm very happy to find the enlightened centrists here in this thread, it allows me to block them so I don't have to listen to "both sides are just as bad" or "this is against the spirit of free speech".
Excellent move by lemmy.world, very happy to be here.
Not for you apparently, I mean you’re not even trying to hide your power trip
And what power would that be? I'm equal to all other users of this instance.
and? so? Do you think thats a good argument against limits? If i was born to a different era, i might have supported slavery. Now we know its wrong. If i still supported slavery, that would be a bad thing.
Life is about growth.
Let's say that was the case. Do you think you would just wake up one day and be anti-slavery all of a sudden? Or, is it far more likely you were brought to that position by debating the issue with other people and finding their arguments convincing?
People also change with time. Ideally we'll get better at tolerating the tolerable and rejecting the previously tolerable.
Word salad!
Then maybe this isn't the federation for you. I'm sure there's at least one host out there without standards.
And if there isn't one can always become the host with no standards!
I haven't tried to run a Lemmy instance yet, but that it is possible is really cool.
You're probably right. I was hoping this would be a place that reminded me more of the old internet, where there wasn't any intellectual guard rails.
I guess those days are good and gone.
There were always 'guard rails' as you put it. If you spouted hate speech or made some other kind of post that offended people then you were likely to end up banned. That's always been true whether it's irc channels, phpbb forums, online chatrooms, reddit, lemmy or whatever the medium of choice at that time was.
If you find an instance without moderation, it will probably have a lot of toxic users and will eventually get defederated by other instances. I saw someone talk about creating a lurker only instance where users can't post anything, so maybe that would work.
You are free to still join exploding heads and their instance if you want. That's the beauty of lemmy. It's also other instances choice to join with them or not. This one chose not.
It means when choosing between allowing people who are minorities, or people who want to harass minorities, the admins here prefer the minorities.
You can have one or the other. I know which I prefer.
Also, horrible politically incorrect jokes are fun, however, the last few years have led to people genuinenly believing in them instead of making fun of them, so things are a bit more uptight generally in the world.
Your last point is so sad. I don't know when it happened but at some point being awful on the internet went from a thing well adjusted people did occasionally for fun to an entire section of the internets' entire personality.
Like that "The first pride celebration" meme is kinda funny until you realize "oh, the person who made this is literally just an asshole".
That's why I avoid making such jokes. It's kind of a 'first you form your habits, then your habits form you' issue.
"You are what you meme."
Nah it's always been like that. You just got used to being in a space that doesn't tolerate the lowest scum of humanity. Places like /pol have existed since the dawn of the internet.
Not gonna defend /pol, but there was a time when /b was funny, right? Like fucking with westboro Baptist church rather than livestreaming mass shootings.
Couldn't tell you. I've never felt to urge to go and use 4chan. In fact I'm pretty sure I'd rather dip my balls in batery acid.
The thing is.... it isn't to protect you if you don't feel you need protection. But this is a community, not a monolith. Consider that you always have the option to join a second community rather than forcing two communities to stay together for your convenience.
And in an online space that's federated, there is a really strong incentive for the admins and mods to keep us *informed when defederation is happening because the community on the other side are extremely likely to notice and let us know either way. So at least you can keep track of how censored these communities are is in some fashion.
You're able to launch your own Instance and it will federate with everyone and you can do what you have stated.
The admins and mods are doing this out of a sense of duty to the community at likely a financial cost to themselves.
I've abandoned many a website because moderating was ruining the experience because users wanted to give too many people too many chances (notably competitive gaming spaces)
I fell into this mistake with a Discord server I moderate. I kept hoping the guy would reform and gave him way too many chances. He eventually crossed the line even with that mentality. There's two big things I've taken from it.
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Mercy shouldn't come at the expense of innocents. Giving a bigot a chance to change, when they've used up several chances, is a disservice to the other users who have to deal with them.
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I was doing this guy a disservice. He needed to learn that actions have consequences, and bigoted behavior earns you the boot. I coddled him by giving him the chances to change and it downplayed the seriousness.
It really helps nobody to have lax moderation, except for the bigots who are proudly bigoted.
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And what's stopping you from checking out exploding heads? The site runners have said that exploding heads stuff isn't appearing on their property. They don't, last I checked, have any control over what sites you visit using your property.
See how that works? Freedom of speech means the shitheads at exploding heads can say what they like, but it doesn't mean other people have to listen. You want to read shitfuckery, they're right over there. Head on over!
This instance smells like Spez, good luck not getting cancelled here
Lemmy mods are no different from Reddit mods really
Nah, the mods who jumped ship were the nice ones. It's the authoritarian assholes like Awkwardtheturtle and iBleeedOrange who stayed on Reddit.
Literally go and see yourself. It's so incredibly lukewarm that it's hilarious to see the level of groupthink and conformity in this thread.
"I hate Nazis"
"Damn I can't believe the groupthink in this thread with everyone agreeing!"
Who's the nazi, point to me where, you guys will call anyone a nazi.
Sit at a table with nazis, get called a nazi.
Repeat the rhetoric of nazis, get called a nazi.
Defend nazis, get called a nazi, it's pretty simple.
How do you determine who a nazi is?
The racist, alt-right garbage memes.
“Nazi” is everyone not agreeing with him, the modern jolly card… it doesn’t really help him that nazis have not been existing since 70 years
Didn't we leave reddit because of this shit?