Terrified friends burn to death trapped in Tesla as doors won't open after crash
Terrified friends burn to death trapped in Tesla as doors won't open after crash
When I first learned that Teslas (and almost all other EV's) have electronic only doors, I knew this kind of situation would happen.
I hope this gets laws enacted that force manufacturers to install mechanical latches on all of their vehicles. I know Teslas have manual overrides on their front doors, but the rear doors still have this issue.It's like if Titanic not only didn't have enough lifeboats, but instead had no lifeboats, and also everyone was locked in their cabins.
The Titantic was designed to stay afloat long enough to allow everyone to disembark in cohorts on life boats to rescue boats and send the lifeboats back for the rest- it was never intended to fit everyone on lifeboats all at once.
It was that a mix of how telephone operators made more money off personal telegrams than ice warnings, and didnt relay the messages, and how nearby possible rescue ships had gone to bed and turned off their radios meant this process didn't get executed, and how because the iceberg hit the ship, essentially creating a large gash the entire length of the ship, causing the flotation bulwarks to be breached, which is a very rare occurrence, caused so much death.
In Tesla's case, that much aforethought hasn't been taken.
I hope this gets laws enacted that force manufacturers to install mechanical latches on all of their vehicles.
Considering Musk's love affair with the incoming administration, I wouldn't bet on it for the next 4 years (hopefully)
In fact I'd be happy to just have the NHTSA avoid being dismantled in the next 4 years
Mid-terms are in 2 years!
NHTSA is part of the executive, so he would still have control over it, but we can at least hopefully place restrictions on his power (or impeach) in 2, assuming the election still happens and the results are accepted.
In general, this isn't exactly a safety conscious administration in those terms.
Prepare to see a lot more products with serious safety issues coast by disinterested regulators and become popular with your friends and family. Peppering your life with a little extra spice.
When I first learned that Teslas (and almost all other EV’s) have electronic only doors
I really just want a regular car with an EV power train. Don't to change a bunch of shit on the car, unless it is germane to its function as an EV. Things like doors, instrument clusters, turn signals, infotainment, HVAC controls, shifting (e.g. park, reverse, drive) should be the same as any other vehicle.
You want an e-Golf, which was a beautifully stupid, half-hearted implementation of an EV by Volkswagen, who because they really didn't want to do it, spent almost nothing on redesign, and in the process creating a ridiculously fun vehicle to drive with sporty handling and high torque at low speed, but nothing else changed from the classic Golf design. Door handles, freaking dials on the dashboard, manual climate and audio controls. Sadly, it isn't being made anymore. We've outgrown ours and it's time for me to let someone else enjoy the experience (especially with the Biden used EV sales incentives going away soon) but my daughter loves it so much that I'm dreading the tantrum that I know will come when I sell it.
The model Y has mechanical emergency door openers in the front. Not in the rear. It complains about possibly breaking window trim when you use them.
They are not super obvious though and you’d have to know in an emergency.
The model 3 and Y both back mechanical backups. I suspect the S does too. The back doors on the X definitely don't, but that's not the only questionable design decision on the X.
Most manufacturers use the door handle to override the electronic system. Like pulling twice or harder than usual.
That's fine then. We're relearning why all cars with manual transmissions have the same foot pedal and shift pattern arrangement. It's so in a panic situation, people aren't having to orientate themselves mentally and can just go off of muscle memory to save themselves. I should be shocked that Tesla didn't hire any auto industry veterans that know that, but I'm not. This reeks of software dev shit where every new MBA coming in just has to shake things up and reinvent everything so they can leave their mark.
Shouldn't an electric be programmed to open if it finds itself undergoing powerloss? Isn't that like a very basic failsafe? One so basic it's the plot to an indie horror game that wasn't intended for children but found an audience there anyway?
Clearly Tesla opted for the fail-deadly route instead of the fail-safe route. Fuckin ridiculous.
In all honesty, I don't see a good solution to electronic doors. If the power dies while it's just sitting in your driveway, now it's open, if the doors open on electricity loss. Definitely better than what they have now, but I'd prefer something completely different. Like what if we had a series of levers and cables that opened the door? I know, it's like, next level crazy, but maybe...
With lord Elon presiding over god king trumps “economy”, I wouldn’t count on that. Adding that safe guard measure would cost him too much.
They have mechanical overrides but look whee some of them are. Have to remove a door panel.
Some of the cheaper ones skip the overrides in the back to deliver more value to shareholders.
Every fucking one of them needs to be recalled.
Teslas (and almost all other EV’s) have electronic only doors
- but Teslas don't.
- we never pluralize with an apostrophe.
There is a manual override in Tesla cars but the feature is not widely publicized, experts say.
Tesla isn't the only culprit here. Any manufacturer that makes cars with electric doors should be required to also have a prominent and easily reachable manual override, instead of hiding a tiny lever underneath the armrest or on the floor, or behind the person's seat on the pillar somewhere, or any fucking place that isn't where you would expect a door handle to be.
Should just be a law to have a regular fucking door handle, we don't need fancy/electric doors. Telsa's should all be taken off the road with their shitty track record.
Yes please, I vote for this one
Or, you could just have the door handle be the manual override.
It is a laughably easy thing to have the release for the door from the inside be the same kind of mechanical door release we've always done, for obvious safety reasons, and then have a little solenoid which can also trigger the release of the mechanical door release if the computer wants it to open.
The only reason to do it otherwise, and then need a separate manual release handle, is if you are okay with people dying in exactly this fashion so that you can make your shiny thing in the exact shiny way you want to make it.
It is so intuitive, just disassemble the door when the car is on fire.
On at least the model 3 and Y it's fairly intuitive for the front seats. For the rear? Not so much.
https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_us/GUID-AAD769C7-88A3-4695-987E-0E00025F64E0.html
Note Not all Model Y vehicles are equipped with a manual release for the rear doors.
:/
Who the fuck thought this up
- Remove the mat from the bottom of the rear door pocket.
- Press the red tab to remove the access door.
- Pull the mechanical release cable forward.
It should be as intuitive as getting out of any car, a regular handle.
Killed by the department of efficiency
It's an apt analogue for what we should all expect from the DOGE; burning to death while everyone watches in terror.
This is what it says on their website. Hope you've got the link handy if you're in a crash, and also that you're not in one that doesn't have this...
Are you kidding meeeee
Look it's very simple if you get in a crash and are on fire.
Stop. Drop. Roll. Remove the mat from the bottom of the rear door pocket. Press the red tab to remove the access door. Pull the mechanical release cable forward. Remember that not all Model Y vehicles are equipped with a manual release for the rear doors. Die.
Rolls right off the tongue. If you're still in trouble call 0118 999 88199 9119 725 3.
Not all Model Y vehicles are equipped with a manual release for the rear doors.
I think I see a problem.
Also: that's waaaay too many steps for an emergency. Imagine trying to dismantle the door trim when you have a concussion.
This is what it looks like when they're legally forced to do something, but still don't want to do it, and their customers are idiots who can afford to pay for redundant features.
So you know, goverment inefficiency. /s
I hear the new guy in charge of that is a genius!
Realistically they should show the owners at the dealership and make sure they open it several times before taking it off the lot then reinforce it in software and make them release it once a month.
Or you know.. just make it mechanical
And what about the passengers? Is the owner going to be required to give an airline attendant “emergency exits are located here” safety speech every time someone hops in the car with them? Can we actually trust them to do so?
Also, not all models have mechanical release mechanisms in the rear doors. There are models where it is 100% possible to just be locked in the back seat. And when you only have ~15 seconds to escape before the lithium flames+smoke cook you, you’re not going to be able to crawl to the front.
It's so easy! When you get in a crash are panicking and disoriented, who needs a simple quick lever that's there at all times??? Simply follow these complicated 3 steps to extract yourself from the burning vehicle!
*not available on all models.
make everything electronic because Elon thinks it is super cool
put very inefficiently placed manual overrides because it was a bad idea
Friendly reminder that everyone should have one of these seatbelt-cutter-window-hammer things in their glovebox
Other nice options as stocking stuffers can be spread around the car, like in each door, glovebox, keychain. The hammer type you linked is easier to hold, but you may not be able to reach the glovebox.
I have broken windows with all three of these exact products during regular extrication training as a firefighter.
Another problem with some teslas (and other vehicles) is that there are switching to laminate for the side window glass for strength purposes. These devices wont work in a survival situation if your car has laminated windows. LINK
I have heard it's easy to kick out the windshield, but I've never had to test that theory.
Aren't Tslas the ones with glove boxes that have to be opened through the console menu?
The front window is made to be easily kicked out from the inside.
In a normal car anyways.
I have one, but the issue is being able to find it in an emergency and remembering that it's there. It's like girls I've known with a 9mm, uh, somewhere, uh, just in case. You actually have to practice some.
For example; Every time my wife starts burning something in the kitchen I get out of my chair and go to the fire extinguisher. Muscle memory is a thing.
I love this idea, I'm going to start practicing it myself.
In my neck of the woods a couple weeks ago five people burned to death in a Tesla. Apparently called 911 from inside the car too. No national news on this either.
In my neck of the woods, four people burned to death in a Tesla last month (news article in French).
I can't believe there isn't an NHTSA regulation about manual egress from an unpowered vehicle. This is just bonkers.
There are manual releases but they're hidden. They need to be more obvious because these cars are rented to people and obviously the owners aren't taking the time to figure out where they're at.
I would also think just having secondary power packs in each door would help in the event power is cut to ensure the doors can continue to function for a few minutes while also a speaker could explain how to use the emergency release if none of the doors are working.
All this added complexity and cost isn't worth it to me, manual doors just make sense for so many reasons.
Or, how about this: it’s a door, have it work like every other car door for the last 70 years.
Redesigning stuff to make it “cool” and “futuristic” is fucking stupid and is clearly not safe. Doors have handles, the handles are pulled to open the door. Keep it simple.
Honestly Tesla should be sued over this
When I rode as a passanger in a Tesla Model 3, the owner told me not to use the big pull handle because it was the manual release, and instead to use the button at the top of the grab bar.
I don't know about the other models but the manual release was a more obvious way to open the door than the intended way.
Only for the front seats, and on something like the Y not all models even have manual releases in the back. The ones that do have them covered with a mat and no indication where they are.
On the model Y you need to removal a speaker grill to manually release the doors in the back.
what a metaphor for America
Well they don't say where it was but I'm assuming it's Canada since a Canada post employee saved one by smashing the window with a big pole so she could crawl out.
It happened in downtown Toronto.
<smashes window> Sorry!
Regardless of where it happened, it’s still an apt metaphor for America
with a bonus nonmetaphorical Musk tie-in.
What fucking idiot builds fail-deadly electric door controls into a very flammable car
Anything owned by Muskrat
There is a manual unlock mechanism, but from what I read it's rather hidden and not very obvious. Sounds like really bad design to me.
Yeah but mechanical car door handles aren't "Cool." You don't want to have a car that isn't cool, right?
Some GenZ kids were talking about how cool rolling up a window with a handle was and wished it was in cars again. It was refreshing to hear.
I'm still worried about going over a bridge and not finding a smashy object fast enough.
Always have an emergency tool in your car to break your windows in case this shit happens to you. Even if you're in a car not designed by a god damn moron.
Tesla uses double pane laminated glass, it doesn't shatter like normal tempered glass. It can be really difficult to break and get through.
Also to break glass, don't hit the middle of the glass, strike near a bottom corner where it is less likely to flex against the impact. You may be able to take a seatbelt's end and use the corner of the metal end of the seatbelt to break it if you have nothing else. Corners for breaking
Didn't these used to be part of the seat belt? Has that standard changed?
Well, any seatbelt still has a metal point or two, which can be used to break the window. But the person inside still needs to be conscious and not-panicking enough to realize that fact.
I put two window smashers with seatbelt cutters in my Wife's Model Y for this reason. The back seat door releases are HARD to notice as they are buried in a door pocket. We are getting rid of the car next year for something made by an actual 100 year old car company and not run by a fucking greedy dork.
Depending on the manufacture date, the side windows on the model Y may be laminated glass. If that's the case with yours, window smashers won't work on those.
So happy my car is not a tesla.
Apparently called 911 from inside the car.
Any car without manual door locks and handles is a death trap. They should be required by law.
Every Tesla on the road has manual door release.
But not on the door handle, rendering it useless in an emergency situation.
Also not true. Their own manual states not all models have manual overrides
In the US there are nine investigations involving the Tesla Model Y, ranging from “unexpected brake activation” to “sudden unintended acceleration,” according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
Nice
Those investigations will all end with "nothing to see here" in about 3 months from now.
Those investigations will all end with "nothing to see here" in about 3 months from now
"Fuck elon musk"
Car: "Error: Electronic Lock Malfunction. Please say 'I love Elon Musk' to begin troubleshooting."
This reminds me... I need a glass breaking hammer for safety in my non Tesla car.
They might all have one but if not, get one that has a seat belt cutter on it. And keep it in the front console, not anywhere in the back or in the glove compartment.
I knew someone (an acquaintance, we weren't close) who died in a crash because their seatbelt got stuck and they couldn't get out. They had one of those cutter hammer combos but it was in the back seat. Absolutely nightmarish.
Also fix it to the console with a clip. Can’t use the cutter when it is out of reach because the car flipped over. And buy more than one, driver could become incapacitated after a crash while the backseat passengers are stuck.
My dad was driving a truck full of pigs back in the 70s. He was driving with 2 friends in a very heavy rain. They were crossing a shitty Mexican bridge when they lost traction and went off into the river upside down. The river/channel was narrow so they doors wouldn't open. They managed to break the windshield and escape. None of the pigs survived. But neither the pigs nor my dad or friends were wearing seatbelts.... because Mexico and 1970's, reasons, etc. I mean the truck was a Datsun and those things did not have seatbelts installed from what I recall.
I ride my bicycle in traffic. I find the differences in our perceived risk profiles funny.
Ah when you try to reinvent the the wheel, fail, and then kill people with it
Turn onto your back with your feet towards the door/ window, grab the steering wheel and the doorward edge of the seat, and kick out the window with both feet. This can also be done from a passenger seat as well.
Has this been tested out in a Tesla? I wouldn't put it past them to make it literally inescapable
Great question! I do not now, nor do I ever expect to have any interest in owning a Tesla. However if you want to give me one, I’d be willing to give it a try.
Find a good lawyer and sue the living shit out of Tesla and "Leon." I agree with the majority of the comments.
We should rebrand him as Emperor Cleon (Day)
"when a crash disabled its electronic doors."
Female AI voice: Please stay in your seats with your seat belts on until Elon has been notified of this incident.
See? This. This is why I don't trust my safety to electronic systems. The fancy computer controlled locks and latches are great when they work. When they don't, shit like this happens.
At least most cars still have a physical connection between the door handle and the locking mechanism. Not Tesla, for no good goddamned reason.
Who could see this coming, other than literally everybody
This isn’t a Tesla or EV problem though. How many back doors have child safety locks?
In my Audis at least, the child safety is disabled together with the locks opening within a few milliseconds of the airbag control unit sending a crash signal across the CAN. That message is sent immediately when the decision to open at least one airbag has been made and therefore will reach all components while the crash hasn't even had time to finish, so all wires and stuff is most likely still in place
Apart from that, the doors have an emergency mechanical release that is "just pull a bit harder and further on the handle". Which is what you'd do anyway.
A: the driver knows they're locked from the inside
B: they're always locked form the inside, they didn't just stop working because the car lost power
C: lithium fire/smoke makes thinking more difficult than an ICE engine fire
EV complicates it
Tesla made it really bad by electric-only locks.
"For god's sake call customer service!!!!"
That one’s a deal breaker. Never getting in an Tesla again. And yes, that means a lot of taxi cabs 🤷♂️🙄
Not any other vehicle...
Everyone keeps commenting mad about "mechanical doors". Y'all. All Tesla's have mechanical release doors. There is caveat on the rear doors:
Model S: Front and rear doors have manual release
Model 3: Front doors; rear doors only on the Model 3 Highland update
Model X: Front doors and rear Falcon Wing doors
Model Y: Front doors; some rear doors
There was one commenter smart enough to caveat the manual release should be easily accessible. I think that's a much better argument, because you can't think straight when you're panicking. But for the love of God, spend 2 seconds thinking before writing your comment.
There are a lot of safety situations where you need a mechanical release, where you won't be able to find the mechanical release if it's a separate control. Obviously the door itself is mechanical. What people are unhappy about is that it doesn't easily open in some types of emergencies. Case in point.
