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If China wins the war of Imperial Expansion vs Taiwan, they'll continue attacking outward, risking Japan and Philippines next, or maybe Korea. Hard to say what their next priority would be, but its up and out in any case.
That's the funny thing about war. When someone wins a war, there's no reason for them to stop. And these ancient empires have memories.
The safest time to handle everything is when the smallest flames of war begin. You snuff it out before it grows any larger. We're going to fight anyway, the question is if we fight for Taiwan, or if we fight at a later stage.
This is the same "Red China" that funded North Korea expansion / the Korean war. They have huge imperialistic and expansionist ambitions. Always have.
Why should I care if China is the empire vs the United States? The United States has been an imperialist, expansionist empire for centuries. You're fear-mongering, but you're really just worried about yourself and you're willing to throw soldiers into a meat grinder for your own job security.
but you’re really just worried about yourself
Yup. I'm a selfish asshole who lives here and cares about my job, my livelihood, and the people I support.
Fuck you too.
But you don't care about the people you want to send off to die? Don't you see how that is selfish?
It's especially bad when you look at the class background of military recruits compared to tech jobs. You're sending the poors to die.
You can get another job, but those families can't get new sons and daughters.
But you don’t care about the people you want to send off to die? Don’t you see how that is selfish?
My uncle is in the marines. So are many of my close friends. Of course I care. But there's also our interests that must be protected.
It’s especially bad when you look at the class background of military recruits compared to tech jobs. You’re sending the poors to die.
Marines in the family yo. You ain't gonna be able to play this card on me. And its the Marines specifically who'd be tasked to protect Taiwan, given the terrain. (Island hopping specialists). Believe me, I know.
You know who are some of the most gung ho people with regards to going out and fighting for us? Even more so than US Army, US Navy or US Air Force?
Marines. I'm serious. If you knew them, you'd know what I'm talking about. Do you know any marines or are you just hypothetically laying out this discussion on me as if I'm an ignorant dumbass? Our job, most of the time, is to hold the Marines back from fighting. They are a bit mad and war-mongery more so than the rest of us. Its in the culture of the Marines.
So its our responsibility to point them in the right direction of what is worthwhile to fight, and what isn't worthwhile. Taiwan would be much, much more important than the desert we sent them to last time.
I'm not playing a card, it seems like you really do value your job over the lives of your military relatives and friends. That's wild to me, but everyone has their own set of values. Yours are demonstrably self-interested.
Again, I see no good reason why the US has to be involved in another imperialist war abroad.
Because the imperialist is China. Not the USA in this case. If you don't like imperialism, then you need to fight back against expansion.
USA hasn't "expanded" in Asia for decades. This is protecting people of Taiwan, who are very close allies of the USA and critical to our economy, while preventing wanton imperial / expansionist China from getting bad ideas for the next decades.
Like, for every "imperialism" word you use in that post above, I'm wondering why you're cool with Chinese expansion or any of the other asshole stuff they've done.
The US is imperialist, and defending Taiwan to maintain a friendly business relationship would just be just another manifestation of that. I don't think the US needs to be world police for China's expansionism. If we're going to interfere with China's business, maybe intervening in the ongoing genocide of Uyghur people would be a good use of military power. But that doesn't help you and your cushy tech job!!
The US is imperialist, and defending Taiwan to maintain a friendly business relationship would just be just another manifestation of that
Yup, defending countries is imperialism. /s Your logic is so great.
maybe intervening in the ongoing genocide of Uyghur people would be a good use of military power.
I thought attacking other countries was imperialism? EDIT: Seriously, what do you want us to do? Invade fucking China over this incident?
Your concept of what is, or isn't, Imperialism is laughable. Defending a country == Imperialism to you, but expanding our region and taking over part of China (where Uyghurs are) isn't imperialism? Or what, how exactly are we supposed to stop China from doing that?
Your whole argument is that China would control Taiwan and the US wouldn't have access to that market anymore in the same way. You only care about Taiwan having independence because you don't want China to be too powerful. You want US to have imperialist power in that region. If you can't see that, idk what to tell you. Your brain is probably just protecting you from seeing the US as an empire because you're emotionally or financially invested in a worldview that legitimizes US military actions abroad.
I'm not really advocating for any particular military action in China, but if we were to go to war, stopping a genocide would be a worthwhile reason. Cheaper computer parts is not. I don't give a shit about your job. Maybe you could do something useful, make food or clean houses.
Your whole argument is that China would control Taiwan and the US wouldn’t have access to that market anymore in the same way.
So you don't care about the millions of people living in Taiwan who'd die in a war vs China? They have a solid military, though not big enough to fight China off. They'd need US help for protection to stand a chance.
You think the Taiwanese are going to roll over without a fight? It'd be brutal. Taiwan is rich, there's huge advantages to island defense (crossing the sea is roughly the same difficulty as the D-Day landings), and they'll fight very hard to defend themselves before they'd lose to China.
But with US Defense, more of them would survive, fewer missiles will wreck their defensess, and Taiwan's economy will be in a better spot for the next decades. Current estimates suggest US + Taiwan alone is enough to hold the island. Yes there will be death and destruction if China attacks, but US soldiers will prevent deaths and in the long term be better for everyone. That's the most important reason on this whole issue (and why I'm confident the Marines who'd fight in this war would gladly fight. A just and fair defense is a better dream than the shit we gave them in Iraq or Afghanistan).
Taiwan btw, has plenty of trade with mainland China. They're physically close like that. The issue is that fair trade is not enough for Xi's China, and we all know that the +400 nukes they've made are in preparation of this conflict.
And again: once China has lots of nukes, a large navy, and a win under their belt, they'll inevitably expand outwards in a true Imperialist fashion. Its the nature of large militaries, once you build one you naturally expand.
All your crocodile tears for the Marines who'd fight for this cause are lost on me, because I know you're a caustic asshole who doesn't actually have much value aside from spouting anti-American rhetoric. But I was waiting for you to make yourself more obvious.
Maybe you could do something useful, make food or clean houses.
And this makes it quite obvious. Your fake imperialism crocodile tears and all that is just that, fake. You don't give a shit about this discussion at all and never had. These are all just abstract internet talking points to you.
But I'll make it clear to you, and everyone involved. I do care about Taiwan, the survival of them as a people, and their friendship with the USA, and their economic ties with us. Hopefully my real empathy reaches the right people over the next years more so than your apathy, so that we Americans can stand united on this next threat.