I'm really rooting for this project; it has a lot of promise. It's crowd-sourced and plans to be ad-free.

If you're more curious about details and future plans for the app, the creator did an AMA on Reddit recently.

> There isn’t much lesson time for international languages.

cross-posted from: https://discuss.online/post/4598074

> Hello everyone, > > I really enjoyed [email protected], but it has been down for a while, so I created [email protected]. The idea is just to have a space to talk about anything in Spanish. > > -- > Hola a todos, > > Realmente disfruté [email protected], pero ha estado caído por un tiempo, así que creé [email protected]. La idea es simplemente tener un espacio para hablar de cualquier cosa en español. > >

That's mostly it. I guess the combination of Duolingo and conjugation can be quite effective.

Also, that's after a year of living in Spain

Seems like an interesting tool

I know they sometimes get a bad rap (especially recently with the lay offs https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2024/01/10/duolingo-ai-layoffs/), but it's still a nice app to use to get started with a language

The immersion style of teaching a language in the purest sense involves refusing to use other languages to aid in teaching the target language. So if you take a French class in France, you might not hear a word of English. Whereas if you take a French class in the US, some teachers will speak English at least in the first few stages.

I find the immersion approach extremely slow and error prone. E.g. if the teacher holds up an image of a red firefighter hat and speaks French, you might not know if she is saying “hard hat”, “red”, or “fire fighter”. You have to guess and if your guess is wrong it feeds into negative training.

There is an audio tape where a Brit teaches French. He said for the most part English words ending in “…tion”, “…ly”, “…ize”, “…ise”, etc are also French words. There are exceptions of course but in just one sentence of English I instantly learned hundreds of French words trivially.

Not sure how thoroughly this has been studied but I suspect immersion language teaching works better on quite young (highly neuroplastic) brains. As an adult it’s very frustrating.

A professor once told me: you don’t need school to learn. You can learn anything by teaching yourself by reading and experiencing the knowledge. But what school does for you is accelerates the learning by structuring it for fast consumption in an organized way. I agree. And I think that the most accelerated way to learn French is to use existing knowledge of English as a tool. Whereas learning by immersion is comparable to learning by experience (the hard way is slow!).

So my ultimate question is whether this as been studied on adults. Does an adult group reach fluency quicker or slower if they learn by immersion? A lot of people say immersion is more effective, but it always seems like this guidance is blind. They never say or imply it’s supported by research. It seems like an indoctrination that people just accept. Different brains are different. An adult who only knows one language will probably be more hindered by immersion because their brain perhaps relies more heavily on associative memory (making connections with existing language knowledge).

Hello everyone,

I thought it might be interesting to have regular catch-ups (e.g. weekly posts) to discuss progress everyone is making on their languages.

Hello! I was just thinking that someone should create a Korean Community similar to Sopuli's Japanese one. I bet there are some Korean learners like myself that would like an alternative to Reddit's version.

This seems like overkill to me, but Lamont is speaking very highly of this method. I personally rewatch movies extremely rarely, and the number of movies that I have seen more than once is very small, so the idea of watching one movie 50 times is rather nauseating.

I do, however, concur that re-consuming A/V media in an L2 is beneficial to me, as I noticed that I tend to struggle with correctly interpreting grammar the first time around.

ForgetMeNot (available in Google Play Store and F-Droid) is a pretty awesome FOSS flash card/quiz app that I'm currently using for my Korean vocab. It has a lot of options and -- importantly for me -- multiple different kind of tests. Self-testing (basic flash card use), multiple choice (they call it "testing with variants"), and spell check. The ability to "invert" cards, so it shows you either the "question" or the "answer" and you provide the other. The ability to hide the "question", so if you want to turn on text-to-speech for phrases/vocab and have to provide the answer by ear.

It's a very neat app, and is a great replacement to paying for Quizlet, in my opinion.

EDIT: My favorite function, which I could not figure out how to do in Quizlet if it's possible at all, is that you can test yourself on multiple sets! I create a new "deck" for each lesson I do in my Korean workbook, and I like to quiz myself on everything I've learned up to now. In Quizlet, I had to go through each lesson individually. ForgetMeNot let's me press and hold to select as many decks as I want, and it shuffles them all together.

Hello all! I'm looking to practice my German with other German learners or patient native-speakers! I'm at/near the A2 level and am actively studying as much as I can! A huge part of learning a language is writing/speaking to others, however, and - living in Ohio in the U.S., I don't have much opportunity for that. So I'm looking online!

I'm looking for either: people here who would like to help me practice, or directions to where I might be able to practice with others.

Thanks! :)

I wrote this six years ago, but I might as well dump my thoughts on language learning here, as well. My opinions on it haven't changed much.

How to learn a language, targeted towards people teaching themselves at home.

Feel free to jump around. It turned out a bit dry.

Learning Strategies

The following are all valid, tested learning strategies, but they may not be right for your learning style or your goals. This is not a collection of resources. Most learners use a combination of these techniques, even within one activity, and some resources are more suited to some techniques than others. Types of resources to be used with each technique will be included in the descriptions.

For simplicity’s sake, I describe each method as it is used as a primary Learning Strategy, but the principles behind why the strategies work can be applied to creating or altering other activities as well. I try to keep theory and history to a minimum and focus on how, but I included enough so that you can google it or ask me in the comments if you want to learn more. Here are some questions to get you thinking about how you’d like to learn:

Question | Suggested learning strategy :--|:-- Are you social or outgoing? | #5 Do you love literature and reading? | #1, #2, #4 Are you learning a language only for reading? | #4 Is being able to speak from day one important? | #2, #5

And if all of this gets too confusing, get a textbook. They’re written to guide you through the process, and the exercises will include activities that exercise the same language muscles as the ones I’m writing about here. Most textbooks are well-suited to #2, #3, and #5.

1. Listening-Reading

The listening-reading (LR) method is, most simply, using bilingual texts with target-language audiobooks. You learn new vocab by comparing the text with the facing English, as opposed to word lists or dictionaries. Grammar is acquired naturally rather than explicitly studied. This technique is based on the idea that the amount of comprehensible input (i.e. listening to things you can mostly understand) is the most important factor in learning another language.

In its purest form, LR allows you to skip the boring textbook sentences and children’s books and go straight to what you want to read. It’s made comprehensible by using parallel texts, rather than relying on the learner to be able to understand most of the language independently. Here is the mother of pure LR’s guide. The writing style is a bit jarring, but there are some very good points and considerations there. It’s essential reading if you want to use LR as your main Learning Strategy.

Lighter forms of LR can also be used in conjunction with other methods, and there’s no one way to do it right. The standard method is as follows:

1. Read the English version of a long text, the longer the better (L1).
2. Read the original text (L2) while listening to the audio.
3. Read the translated text (L1) while listening to the audio again. This is the most important part and the only step that cannot be skipped under any circumstances.

Repeat these steps until it gets too easy, then get a different book. Doing another repetition using the shadowing technique is a good way to get some pronunciation and speaking practice in with this method as well.

You have to get a feel for what works for you.

Warning! If you’re not really analyzing the text in detail and figuring out how the language works, what you’re doing is extensive reading/listening. That’s good practice, but it’s in the Practice Activities section rather than the Learning Strategies section for a reason. A good rule of thumb is that if you don’t understand it, it’s not helping you much. More on that in the Practice section.

Pros:

• Instantly engage with content interesting to you
• All vocab and grammar is learned in context
• No explicit grammar instruction (only a pro if you’re someone who freezes up when they hear words like verb, adjective, conjugate, or decline)
• Good for learners who have large chunks of time to dedicate to learning, scales well with long study sessions, even upwards of 9 or 10 hours at a time
• Lots of listening practice from the very beginning

Cons:

• Requires extreme amounts of concentration
• No hand-holding, your brain has to do the work of figuring out the language itself, and you have to schedule and motivate yourself
• Difficult to gauge progress at the beginning. It will likely be at least 100 hours before you start understanding noteworthy amounts of native speech in the wild
• Easy to fall into the trap of not focusing and analyzing enough, which leads to very slow or nonexistent progress. And because it’s difficult to gauge progress, you could spend 50 hours “studying” with little to show for it if you’re not careful
• Easy to get demotivated because of how little you understand at the beginning
• Not a particularly efficient method if you can’t dedicate at least two hours at a time to it. This method scales very well with long study sessions, but if you only have 30 minutes at a time, you’d be better off doing something else

In short, this is a powerful method for confident learners, but it’s easy to mess it up. For people who are trying to learn their first foreign language, I would not recommend using LR as your primary learning method. It is, however, a great activity if you have a whole weekend and want to spend it doing nothing but studying.

Further reading: 1

2. Shadowing

Strictly speaking, shadowing is pronunciation practice. It’s much like repeating or echoing L2 audio, but done simultaneously as the L2 audio continues to play. The reason it’s in the Learning Strategies section is because of how it’s used in conjunction with a resource like Assimil, which is what I’ll be focusing on here.

For those unfamiliar with Assimil, it’s a collection of about 100 short dialogues or occasionally monologues with facing translation in English (L1) and audio recordings of the dialogues. Linguaphone is another set of similarly structured courses that work well with this method. With a little adaptation, this can work with Glossika or FSI as well. Assimil is not explicitly designed for shadowing, but it’s almost perfectly suited for it.

The learning itself occurs similarly to the LR method, in that you are comparing text/audio to a translation in English (L1). Assimil has two huge advantages, though, in that a) it is designed to introduce less complex words and grammar first and gradually get harder and b) there are notes and explanations to help you figure out why things are the way they are. Here’s how it looks:

First, put the lesson you’re working on on repeat. Keep your book closed. Try to speak along with what you’re hearing. After doing that a few times, open your book and read along with the English while continuing to listen and speak along with the audio. Then begin to read the L2 text and glance over to the English (L1), still listening and speaking along with the audio. Turn off the audio, analyze the text and the translation, read the notes and look up anything you don’t understand, then do any exercises in the book. Read the L2 text out loud, then play the audio again and shadow it. Check your pronunciation against the audio recording.

Depending on you goals and how much time you have, there are some more activities you can do with the lesson as well. You can do a dictation exercise by listening to the audio and writing or typing out the text, then checking what you wrote with the text in the book. You can do scriptorium. You can record yourself reading or shadowing the dialogue and compare it with the audio. After you’ve studied the lesson as outlined above, you can use it as passive listening practice when you can’t spare the attention to properly study, for example on a commute or while doing the dishes.

Even if you don’t follow the method as strictly as outlined above, or if you don’t think shadowing suits you as a primary Learning Strategy, it’s a great activity to incorporate into the study of any textbook or material that has audio dialogues. At an intermediate or advanced level, shadowing audiobooks is a very effective and efficient exercise.

This is based mostly on Professor Arguelles’s shadowing method. The Shadowing Step by Step video at the bottom of this page is a very detailed, in-depth look at the method and how to do it. Professor Arguelles can be a bit eccentric, and like many polyglots tends to be a bit dogmatic about the way that works best for them, but he’s undoubtedly one of the most skilled language learners in the world. You can learn a lot from listening to or reading what he has to say about it, even if you think some of it won’t work for you.

Pros:

• Practices speaking, listening, and reading
• Clear, structured learning as laid out in a textbook like Assimil
• Grammar explanations
• Vocabulary and grammar is learned in contexts
• Easy to gauge progress and see improvement

Cons:

• Although more structured than some strategies, Assimil doesn’t guide you through the learning process as much as other textbooks. Some degree of learner autonomy is required
• Assimil and other shadowing-friendly resources cost money
• Requires ~30 minute chunks of uninterrupted, focused study time

This is a solid method that is clear, easy to follow for inexperienced learners, and available for a wide variety of languages. This is one of my top picks that works well for most learners.

continued in comments

I figured I'd post what I can find of my collection of bilingual books. They're mostly Polish/English and Russian/English, but there's a Chinese, Greek, and an Indonesian book in there, as well. They all have matching audiobooks.

It looks like there's not a language learning community on Lemmy, but we can change that! I hope everyone can post some of their favorite resources, ask questions, and get some discussion going.

If you see any other communities I haven't already gotten on the sidebar, post them, too! The bigger the language learning ecosystem around here, the better.